SC

SC Highway Patrol Shooting Is About To Get Interesting …

SOLICITOR’S “CLEAN SHOT” ASSESSMENT IS CHALLENGED …  Let’s make one thing perfectly clear right out of the gate: Primary seat belt enforcement is exactly what we said it was four years ago, “an excuse for the cops to pull you over.” Or in this case, shoot you … Last week,…

SOLICITOR’S “CLEAN SHOT” ASSESSMENT IS CHALLENGED … 

Let’s make one thing perfectly clear right out of the gate: Primary seat belt enforcement is exactly what we said it was four years ago, “an excuse for the cops to pull you over.”

Or in this case, shoot you …

Last week, 35-year-old Levar Edward Jones of Columbia, S.C. – the assistant manager at a local Subway restaurant – pulled his car into a Circle K convenience store on Broad River Road (which for those of you not familiar with South Carolina’s state capital is not exactly the best neighborhood in town).

Jones – an unarmed black man with no prior criminal record – was minding his business.

Unfortunately for him, Lance Corporal Sean M. Groubert of the S.C. Highway Patrol – who was pulling out of the convenience store as Jones was pulling in – observed that Jones was not wearing his seat belt.

Obviously at this point, in a free (and rational) society, Jones should have been permitted to continue about his business.  And Groubert should have, in the local parlance, “kept on truckin’.”

That’s not what happened, though.

Thanks to South Carolina’s primary enforcement law (championed by the liberal mainstream media), Groubert swung his patrol car back into the Circle K parking lot and attempted to detain Jones, who at this point had already exited his vehicle and was walking into the store.

He never made it …

Instructed by Groubert to produce his identification, Jones reportedly reached for his back pocket only to find he had left his wallet in his vehicle.  When he reached into his car to retrieve it, that’s when Groubert (who is white) is said to have opened fire – hitting Jones once in the thigh and striking his vehicle four times.

Wow …

Thankfully, Jones did not sustain serious injuries and is expected to make a full recovery.

Senior officials at the S.C. State Law Enforcement Division (SLED) who have viewed the dash cam video from Groubert’s car (and the Circle K’s surveillance video) as part of an investigation into the incident tell FITS “there’s a problem.”  Meanwhile senior officials at South Carolina’s fifth circuit solicitor’s office – which has jurisdiction in this case – tell FITS the shooting was “clearly unjustified under the circumstances.”

Unfortunately for them, their boss – solicitor Dan Johnson – doesn’t agree.

Johnson – who reviewed the recordings over the weekend – told SLED Chief Mark Keel that he believed Groubert’s use of force was warranted, describing the incident as a “clean shot.”

Maybe Johnson is right.  We haven’t seen the available “video replays” yet, and as one of our law enforcement sources recently wrote there is something to be said for leaving race out of these discussions (until there’s a credible reason to inject it into the conversation, anyway).

Here’s the thing, though: White cop/ black victim or black cop/ white victim … the fact remains police should not be allowed to pull people over for not wearing their seat belts.

Also, as we’ve said repeatedly in the wake of the Ferguson debacle, all law enforcement officers should be independently wired when they are on duty.

RAPID REACTION

UPDATE: Groubert to be prosecuted for assault …

UPDATE II: Video of the incident …

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251 comments

SC Political Digest September 7, 2014 at 7:35 pm

You think seat belt laws are burdensome, wait ’til Obama breaks your stupid @$$ w/ Obamacare that you told us was going to cost less, insure 40 million more people, and gives us all better coverage…Dumb@$$…

March in lockstep w/ the federal gov’t..and this is what happens..and you can go look in the mirror, if you want to find the idiot to blame…

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 7:39 pm

“Jones – an unarmed black man with no prior criminal record …”

FALSE! Check your “facts”, Will. Perhaps his transgressions were minor to many of us, but he has a criminal record.

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 7:57 pm

“… Perhaps his transgressions were minor to many of us, but he has a criminal record.”

Everyone has a criminal record. It is difficult to prove otherwise. You have one in South Carolina because you don’t live there. (Me too.)

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 8:43 pm

Hi Lisa Ka! Usually, minor traffic violations are not counted as being part of a person’s “criminal” history. That said, you are correct, it is not hard to get a criminal record (or a traffic one) because with each passing year, or Legislature makes more and more aspects of human behavior a crime. This is where the ancient saying, “the more laws, the less justice”, comes into play in a big way.

Even so, quite a few of us have managed to make it past the half-century mark and not incur any criminal records. That’s not to say we haven’t committed acts that could be charged against us as crimes, just that we had the good judgment and luck to not do it so often or so blatantly that we got caught and charged for them.

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:10 pm

“… it is not hard to get a criminal record (or a traffic one) because with each passing year, our Legislature makes more and more aspects of human behavior a crime. …”

It is a jail-able offense to spit on the sidewalk in Singapore. Soon in your local?

Best question for any campaigner: “Mr. Candidate, what part of the Constitution do you want to change?”

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Yes, but September 7, 2014 at 9:26 pm

” That’s not to say we haven’t committed acts that could be charged
against us as crimes, just that we had the good judgment and luck to not
do it so often or so blatantly that we got caught and charged for them.”

Let’s also keep in mind that if you are past the half century mark you came up in a generation where many acts of devlish youth weren’t codified into felonies….the American political justice system has made criminals of what would have simply been described “youthful exuberence” 50 years ago.

So the ever expanding legal system and criminalization of a bazillion victimless crimes has helped to make it so very few people make it to their 30’s without some type of ridiculous interaction with law enforcement.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 9:35 pm

Oldcola, you are SO correct about that!!!! Kids cannot just be kids anymore. Look at the situation in Summerville (I believe) recently, where a kid was arrested resulting from a writing assignment where he said he killed his neighbor’s pet dinosaur and bought a gun to “take care of business” in doing so. WTF???? I don’t know which is more sad, the idiot school officials who made a stink over this or the cops who lacked the common sense and spine to tell the idiot school officials to screw off. I’ve said for some years now, it’s no wonder kids are going apeshit and shooting up schools and such. NO, I don’t condone that, but for crying out loud, they aren’t allowed to be kids anymore. Playground fights that used to get them a trip to the principals office at worst, now result in arrests and police records. Put them under enough pressure and yeah, they’re eventually going to explode. It is as if they are being conditioned to accept their role in life as inmates or something.

truthmonger September 7, 2014 at 11:49 pm

Probably had less to do with “idiot” cops, and more to do with “idiot” legislators who put must arrest clauses in laws, taking away all discretion from officers.

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 11:50 pm

There is always that, too!

truthmonger September 7, 2014 at 11:47 pm

And this is the reason we should be willing to pay a good salary for police…. so we can attract more of the right kind of officer, and keep them. Good cops who understand the law and proper application are getting harder to recruit these days. Why? Because they want to provide for their families and the private sector pays so much better -and is safer.

Yes, but September 8, 2014 at 9:39 am

“Good cops who understand the law and proper application are getting harder to recruit these days.”

I don’t think that’s the solution, I defer to your earlier statement about “”idiot” legislators who put must arrest clauses in laws” as the bigger problem.

With a significant portion of “marginally immoral” behavior becomes codified criminal action(with no victim none the less), with, as you put it no discretion left to the officer, then a cop actually has the law working against him(no fault of his own), so that now every day he has to choose when or not to enforce the law…then the slippery slope ensues.

We all know every day cops observe people breaking laws…so they exercise discretion every day…but that very common sense also puts their jobs in jeopardy.

It’s all the fault of the legislators.

Every year our governments pass more laws…yet far less get struck down…more and more just get piled on us and it’s called “progress”. It’s absurd.

Shadow of EricHolder September 7, 2014 at 11:57 pm

By the way, do you remember the summer after your junior year in college, when you had a job in Venice as a gondolier? You paddled those blonde Swedish girls wherever and whenever they wanted you to?
Sir, you are damn lucky that did not occur in our jurisdiction! We not only have our eyes on you, but WE HAVE THAT PADDLE!

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CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 12:15 am

Ah, Agnetha and Frida! When I was near them I could always hear the SOS!

Sympathetic idiot September 7, 2014 at 8:45 pm

(Me too: I have gotten several speeding tickets in other states, so in the eyes of South Carolina Law Enforcement, I am “suspect” .)
Dumbest thing ever written on here. Thank you. Comparing a speeding ticket to a drug charge. Wow. You are a moron!
And no, not “just about everyone over the age of 12 has a criminal record. I don’t and I have many friends that don’t. We were taught right from wrong, and didn’t break the law.

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:04 pm

“… Comparing a speeding ticket to a drug charge. Wow. You are a moron! …”

You may not be too keen on the latest: NSA spying has allowed big g’ment heat to associate and co-mingle with your very own locals. If you take a plane ride, your photograph is also captured and linked to these shared files. with … Israeli Intelligence, too … and Interpol … and anyone with the proper passwords.

And mistakes happen … ALL of the time! You police files have as many errors in it as mine. So did His. So do any and all of us.

Speaking of errors: My Father was arrested for a supposed crime I committed … while passing through Illinois! … He was taken downtown in cuffs and His car was impounded. Guess who turned out to be the moron(s) in that hose-up?

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Sympathetic idiot September 7, 2014 at 9:27 pm

and any of that ramble BS you just wrote has to do with you comparing a speeding ticket to a drug charge how?

Sympathetic idiot September 7, 2014 at 9:32 pm

oh yeah and to answer your question “Speaking of errors: My Father was arrested for a supposed crime I committed … while passing through Illinois! … He was taken downtown in cuffs and His car was impounded. Guess who turned out to be the moron(s) in that hose-up?”
I would say YOU since it was your crime

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 10:19 pm

Well, if you must know. The drug charge was mine: Federal/Treasury shortly after the 1968 democrat convention riots in Chicago = “being in the presence of …”. Released “no harm, no fowl”, the chicken shiites.

16 years later!, the local yokels in central Illinois outside of Moline, busted my father thinking it was me. The local chief of police did apologize and they gave Him a ride to His car.

Apparently, as mentioned elsewhere, just about everyone’s police records have errors … In this case, my Father’s name happened to be mine as well.

Sympathetic idiot September 8, 2014 at 7:35 am

So you were speeding or had drugs, you still don’t answer how or why you say they are the same, you just ramble on about nonsense.

FastEddy23 September 9, 2014 at 10:03 pm

So you have an aptly chosen screen name.

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 8:56 pm

Most traffic tickets (that are handled by the violator properly, fines paid…) do not go into a “criminal record” and in fact are expunged from your driving record every seven years. Reckless driving, failure to yield… are “criminal acts” but generally misdemeanors. (never pay a reckless driving ticket without going to court to get the charge reduced to a speeding infraction first)

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Waiting 4 U September 8, 2014 at 1:54 am

Driving over the speed limit is even a criminal offense pursuant to the South Carolina Code of Laws (SCCOL).

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Waiting 4 U September 8, 2014 at 2:02 am

SECTION 56-5-1520

(G) A person violating the speed limits established by this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction for a first offense, must be fined or imprisoned as follows:

(1) in excess of the above posted limit but not in excess of ten miles an hour by a fine of not less than fifteen dollars nor more than twenty-five dollars;

(2) in excess of ten miles an hour but less than fifteen miles an hour above the posted limit by a fine of not less than twenty-five dollars nor more than fifty dollars;

(3) in excess of fifteen miles an hour but less than twenty-five miles an hour above the posted limit by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than seventy-five dollars; and

(4) in excess of twenty-five miles an hour above the posted limit by a fine of not less than seventy-five dollars nor more than two hundred dollars or imprisoned for not more than thirty days.

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 4:26 am

I think I said that, but you won’t find your traffic tickets in your “criminal record” as they clear every seven years and are held in a different database.

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 6:57 am

Wanna see what’s in your “driver record”? Go here: https://www.scdmvonline.com/DMVpublic/trans/DRecPoints.aspx

Mike at the Beach September 7, 2014 at 11:21 pm

It’s not *at all* difficult to prove that your abjectly stupid claim that “just about everyone over the age of 12 has a criminal record” is, well, stupid. Look at the annual reports on crime data (all publicly available with a year or two lag) and the multitude of sociological and criminological studies run on those numbers. Most people do NOT have a criminal record. I’m not even sure that this is a real comment on your part; your fairly new account and lack of time here make me wonder if you’re not just stirring the pot.

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edr September 7, 2014 at 7:59 pm

Pled guilty to simple possession of marijuana on 5.25.11 fined 620.00

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ChimpOut September 7, 2014 at 8:21 pm

Never appeared, never paid the fine, has a warrant for failure to appear/pay. That’s likely what caused the category 5 chimpout that lead to a bullet in the thigh.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 8:24 pm

Exactly what I was thinking!

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Squishy123 September 7, 2014 at 10:28 pm

Was all this known between the time the cop pulled back into the parking lot and him firing? Seems to me that it wouldn’t take that long to exit a vehicle and start walking into the store.

Nope September 7, 2014 at 10:32 pm

Of course not. It’s used to characterize, sometimes for nefarious reasons. It may or may not be germane.

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:40 pm

Hi Squishy, I’m not sure exactly how you mean this. For certain, it was known to the guy who had the outstanding warrants, whether or not the Trooper already knew or not. Likely, this knowledge did contribute to his (probably less than cooperative) attitude toward the cop.

TSIB September 8, 2014 at 5:52 pm

You racist sacks of shit are why the GOP and its junior auxiliary party, the “Libertarians,” are sinking like stones.

Assholes.

CriticalMass September 9, 2014 at 2:39 am

You seem to see racism here. Why? There is none.

Maybe you are trying to earn the “racist” or “asshole” moniker for yourself.

Rocky September 8, 2014 at 9:35 am

So we should shoot people in the legs because they refused to show up for a court appearane for smoking a joint? Really? What do we do if they were snorting a lne, behead them on You Tube? Seriously, he could have blocked the vehicle and called in backup to arrest him on a bench warrent. A shot to the leg? Dang!

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Correct! September 8, 2014 at 9:40 am

The cop was shooting to kill, he was incompetent in his shooting fortunately.

I’m surprised he didn’t finish the job given what he faces now.

CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 9:46 am

Of course not, regarding shooting someone just for failing to show up for court on a reefer charge. His point is that this may tend to show a tendency of the suspect to disregard the law which can (and frequently does) include violent outbursts toward a cop who tries to arrest for previous clashes with the law. Had the guy cooperated with the cop, not been threatening or physically resistive, he likely would have been transported to jail and given the option of paying the fine or spending the time proscribed in his sentence in lieu of the fine. Instead, (and I’d put money on this as I am a student of patterns in life) he likely chose to act the jackass, doing more than trying to get in his car, and got shot for his efforts.

Rocky September 8, 2014 at 10:48 am

What source do we have to say he was threating to the cop or acting violently. Not saying he didn’t just asking for the verifiable infromation that the guy was acting violently. And if there was a banch warrent out for him – why did they not enforce that previously. If you’re a student of patterns of life, you know people do illogical thinks, and stupid is one of them. Sounds like the officer might have done something stupid as well.

CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 10:54 am

That the officer may have done something stupid has not been entirely ruled out. That much is true. IF I were betting on this, my money says that it went down pretty close to the way CO above said it did. That is one of those patterns that repeats itself quite commonly. I have no source of verifiable information. This, like so many comments expressed on here by so many people, is my opinion and unless or until it is found to be in error, it will remain so.

Diegoal September 25, 2014 at 10:24 am

“Instead, (and I’d put money on this as I am a student of patterns in life) he likely chose to act the jackass, doing more than trying to get in his car, and got shot for his efforts.”

You’re the jackass,

CorruptionInColumbia September 25, 2014 at 11:51 am

I called this one wrong. Hey, it happens to the best of us at one time or another.

TSIB September 8, 2014 at 5:51 pm

Well then, clearly deserved to be shot.

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Jamie Crater September 7, 2014 at 7:41 pm

I think Police Officers should just stop enforcing laws until they are called and a warrant is issued. Play it safe men and make sure you get home every night.

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:31 pm

Look, the local police procedures and system is flawed, fur sure. Always has been, always will … But it is a good system that allows a local police to stop and ask of any character, black or white, “what’s going on here?” And despite all of the faults, the TSA procedures at the airports are good enough until a better system comes along. (There is a better system, but it has not been fully implemented as yet.)

“… Play it safe men and make sure you get home every night.”

There is a very good short story by Robert Heinlein called “The Pedestrian”. Check it out.

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truthmonger September 7, 2014 at 11:54 pm

Given the low pay, not such a bad idea. Ignore the guy climbing out of the window with a TV set…. haven’t gotten a call yet. Or the drunk careening down the highway…. hasn’t hit anyone yet, ignore him. Whatever.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 11:57 pm

I believe some of the older guys, as they get closer to their retirement date, actually find the wisdom in that course of action or inaction. Why would they screw up their approaching future and emancipation to make an arrest that may result in destruction of their career, reputation, finances, and even a loss of freedom? The public in whose behalf they would be acting will likely be ungrateful and jeering for the lynching that the media will be instigating.

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TontoBubbaGoldstein September 7, 2014 at 7:48 pm

Instructed by Groubert to produce his identification, Jones reportedly reached for his back pocket only to find he had left his wallet in his vehicle. When he started to make his way back to his car, that’s when Groubert (who is white) is said to have opened fire – hitting Jones once in the thigh and striking his vehicle four times.

TBG (not an apologist for the PoPo, BTW) seriously doubts this is anywhere near an accurate description of what took place.

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Mike at the Beach September 7, 2014 at 11:40 pm

Of course it’s not- no elected solicitor would have the nuts to back that up if it was (even if he wanted to) knowing full well that the video will be released in full at some point. Likewise, no “senior” SLED officials commented on that tape to Will or anyone else in the media. The desperation to make this a big story is just palpable, just as is the weird fixation with the ginormous intrusion into everyone’s personal liberty and right to enjoy a free life in this country- the seat belt law. Weird.

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Waiting 4 U September 8, 2014 at 1:51 am

From my study of your behavior on this site, I have concluded that your blood is poisoned with an enormous amount of hate. Your life must be really miserable. In that respect, serious cognitive therapy might help you to identify what causes such hate – and anger. And don’t frivolously say it is what Sic writes. If you have a problem with what he writes, and you continue to keep posting such hatefully negative comments, it shows your character as being that of a ‘sociopath.’ …… Now with that said, I am using the name “Waiting 4 U” inasmuch I am conducting a test. Go figure.

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Mike at the Beach September 8, 2014 at 2:01 am

I love when clowns on interweb discussion boards claim clairvoyant ability; it makes them seem really, really smart. If you see “hate” in the purely political analysis to which we’re referring, I can only say that we’re too far apart in the world to even waste time having a discussion. I’ve seen a lot of hate in the world, but I’m fairly certain that calling a political position weird doesn’t really qualify. Don’t drive angry. Namaste…

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Waiting 4 U September 8, 2014 at 2:03 am

I knew you would bite. And you react according to studies.

Mike at the Beach September 8, 2014 at 3:14 am

Oh I get it now…this is one of those “he who gets the last word” things. I wasn’t on script, sorry. Name one “study” that relates to this silly game and I’ll buy you a steak. No real academic (or even an educated person) would ever even utter the phrase “react according to studies.” You’re still driving angry.

???, ??? September 8, 2014 at 7:34 am

You are dreaming in the throes of a fever or laboring under a madness. No worries, Mike The Lab Rat. You still qualify to be included in our study – related to imbeciles and significantly impaired cognitive functions, such as yours I might add. We find it of interest as to how you seem to enjoy attacking Sic. As a child, did you find gratification in the torture of small animals? In any event, your non-stop attacks on Mr. Folks are, in part, totally uncalled for, disrespectful, mean spirited, and reflect upon an individual suffering from low self esteem.

Mike at the Beach September 8, 2014 at 7:56 am

The fact that you’ve “diagnosed” me via an analysis of a political debate on a website devoted to…

…wait for it…

…political debate (!) says everything we need to know about your reasoning skills. This is where I invoke TBG Rule #3 and depart the “discussion.” Good day.

Ike At The Swamp September 8, 2014 at 11:34 am

Dude. Whasssssssup???

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 8:05 am

“..your non-stop attacks on Mr. Folks are, in part, totally uncalled for, disrespectful, mean spirited….”
You don’t come here much do you?

idcydm September 8, 2014 at 8:58 am

“We …”, you must have a turd in your pocket.

??? x 2 September 8, 2014 at 10:50 am

No question he has it in for Sic Willie. Only CNSYD has a bigger hard on for the Sic one.

I agree too that it’s driven by hate. Well adjusted people don’t spend time in place they routinely dislike, so there’s some pathology there whether they admit it or not.

Sailor September 8, 2014 at 12:23 pm

So we’d love to hear your diagnosis for Grand Tango!

??? x 2 September 8, 2014 at 12:53 pm

Too long, plus it’s the other guy doing diagnosing. I’m just agreeing.

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 4:56 pm

You’re missing the point – it’s fun to pick on Will. He gets to set the agenda but we get to throw slings and arrows of (often) outrageous accusations at him. I come here because it’s the one place I can freely discuss politics and current events without hurting some of my tender coworker’s feelings.

Will’s a big boy, he can handle it – as for the rest of us, anyone who wears their emotions on their sleeve here will get their feelings hurt. This is a full contact web site – Liz and Mandee and the “lesbian pixie” (whatever her name is) have all figured that out

Toyota Kawaski September 9, 2014 at 8:53 am

lesbian pixie hahahha that is the perfect name. Thanks for making my day. +200

rwwllms September 11, 2014 at 6:03 pm

Study me! If Mike won’t participate I’ll volunteer! Is there any kind of pay involved for being part of this study? I could really use some cash.

***waiting to see how it reacts to my study of it***

shifty henry September 8, 2014 at 7:39 pm

This odd cretin has posted the same peculiar comments directed toward others on Fitsnews, including me. His/her spittle had absolutely nothing to do with my comments. My guess is that his/her postings are part of a class project – which makes me wonder how the grading is evaluated.

Toyota Kawaski September 9, 2014 at 8:49 am

Im waiting for you to GTFA. Did you finish Clemson?

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TSIB September 8, 2014 at 5:49 pm

It OUGHT to be big story when a cop can just pull an unarmed otherwise law-abiding citizen over for the crime of not wearing a seat belt and then shoot him.

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Jimmy Fullwood September 26, 2014 at 7:00 am

Personal liberty and right to enjoy a free life in this country you say? Nothing is free in this country you have to pay for it everyday that you live here unless you are on welfare or just simply take it from someone else who paid for it…..

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delbert norquest September 8, 2014 at 8:31 am

New t-shirt adv on E-bay. Hands up don’t shoot mother fucker.

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Nostradumbass October 23, 2014 at 8:56 am

Boy, doesn’t your statement look silly now?

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TontoBubbaGoldstein October 23, 2014 at 12:20 pm

Boy, doesn’t your statement look silly now?

Yes.
Yes it does.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 8:12 pm

“Here’s the thing, though: White cop/ black victim or black cop/ white victim … the fact remains police should not be allowed to pull people over for not wearing their seat belts.”

On that, we do agree!

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:17 pm

“… the fact remains police should not be allowed to pull people over for not wearing their seat belts. …” “… we do agree!”

I was stopped for that very thing in Taxifornia … in the middle of the Golden Gate Bridge! No kidding! Traffic was backed up for miles. I did have my seatbelt on, so He ever so kindly let me go. (I’m black Irish with a touch of Neanderthal.)

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 9:23 pm

Glad he let you go, at least!

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idcydm September 7, 2014 at 10:37 pm

Should there be seat belt laws, no. Should seat belts be used, yes buy if you don’t it’s a good means of natural selection.

BTW only New Hamphire has no seat belt laws.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:41 pm

They must be trying to stay true to their state motto.

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CriticalMass September 9, 2014 at 2:27 am

I’m repeating myself for the most part from just above, but I believe this is important info:

Re: the seatbelt law, I believe it is a very good thing and people should be fully on board with it because belts do much more than “save you from yourself.”

If you need to brake and swerve to avoid an accident, or if you get hit and
spun around, belts keep you planted in the driver’s position so you can control your vehicle when things come back closer to normal. If you’re not belted, you can be thrown over to the passenger side and if that happens, you will probably lose contact with the brake pedal and possibly the steering wheel. This affects the safety of the vehicles near yours.

Also, the “thrown clear is safer in case of fire or going into water” claim is another myth, statistically. A driver (or passenger) is helped by *not* being belted in only one out of 10,000 serious accidents. So not wearing seatbelts is like playing Russian Roulette with a pistol that has one empty chamber out of 10,000.

Seatbelted drivers are safer themselves and make travel safer for other
drivers near them… their passengers are safer, too.

Ultimately, in the absence of the seatbelt law, we would all probably be paying more for auto and life insurance and there would be more deaths and serious injuries, so as much as I have libertarian tendencies, I think it’s a very bad idea to badmouth seatbelt laws.

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Bring out the vid! September 7, 2014 at 8:38 pm

Can’t wait to see the video.

Hope the vids are FOIA’d, I don’t trust the system to produce outcomes that are bad for government agents.

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Greg Prewitt September 7, 2014 at 8:45 pm

Y’all are pathetic.

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Jackie Chiles September 7, 2014 at 8:49 pm

Good thing guy didn’t get killed over a seatbelt violation.

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oldcola September 7, 2014 at 9:17 pm

That thug/trash will catch his bullet sooner or later, and statistics overwhelmingly dictate it will be from “anotha brotha”. I’m sure his attitude was just lovely. The officer didn’t make the law, just doing his job.

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You're an idiot September 7, 2014 at 9:28 pm

Yea, you’re right. Better to just shoot him now for what he might do down the road. Skipping out on a marijuana charge and not wearing a seatbelt certainly suggests he’s a menace to society.

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oldcola September 7, 2014 at 9:42 pm

He’s trash on his way to a no good end any way you want to look at it. Do you think he responded to the stop as a courteous young man on his way up the social/business ladder? Or a rude, chip on his shoulder thug looking to escalate a situation?

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You're an idiot September 7, 2014 at 9:43 pm

Who knows how he responded? Oh, that’s right…you do. I’ve got an idea, let’s wait for the video before making assumptions.

oldcola September 7, 2014 at 9:52 pm

Hard to imagine the officer just pulled his gun and shot him for the heck of it. Especially since this young man is undoubtedly the kindest, biggest hearted, sings in the choir, never hurt a fly, lights up the room with his smile, loves his little brothers, kind of man you ever met.

You're an idiot September 7, 2014 at 9:53 pm

You’re really good at telling stories and the use of hyperbole.

fuck you oldcola September 7, 2014 at 10:17 pm

you’re a real racist piece of shit.

You're an idiot September 7, 2014 at 10:29 pm

He never brought race into the subject on this thread, am I missing something or are you assuming things just like him?

Smirks September 8, 2014 at 8:36 am

He never brought race into the subject on this thread, – 10 hours ago

That thug/trash will catch his bullet sooner or later, and statistics overwhelmingly dictate it will be from “anotha brotha”. -oldcola, 11 hours ago

You're not an idiot September 8, 2014 at 9:41 am

Ah, thank you, I didn’t catch that.

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:51 pm

LOL. Is this the southern sense of humor I keep hearing about? Or southern hospitality?

Come on, you guys, he could have been hurt.

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:56 pm

He was shot, how much more hurt did he need to be?

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 10:04 pm

LOL … Yeah, I got that. Jus’ trying to follow through on the jocularity.

Smirks September 8, 2014 at 8:33 am

That thug/trash will catch his bullet sooner or later, and statistics overwhelmingly dictate it will be from “anotha brotha”.

You sure make a lot of assumptions just based on the guy’s skin. Nobody here knows who the fuck the dude is or what he’s like, but if anyone is “sure” of what it might be, it’s you, right?

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Larry Bishop September 7, 2014 at 9:03 pm

Watch the news about to get interesting …:)

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7th Son September 7, 2014 at 9:06 pm

Glad that no one died. One in the thigh and four in a parked car, Groubert needs to spend some time on the shooting range.

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The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:10 pm

I had the same thoughts – who teaches these guys to shoot?

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 9:21 pm

Ditto! This is his second shooting. The first, involving a white male who was shooting at him, was definitely justified, a couple of years ago. That one lived. This one lived. Is it his marksmanship or an issue with the .45 GAP round? Of course, with so many wanting this guy lynched at least he can show that he is not a cold-blooded “killer”.

For years, I noted time after time, shootings of and by good and bad guys using .40 caliber weapons and how it was so rare that anyone died from being hit with those rounds. Stops were even “iffy” at very best. I would not have dreamed of carrying a .40 at that point in time because they seemed to be so ineffective. Over time, I noted that with heavier (actually the standard 180 grain load for that caliber) loads seemed to perform as you would expect any caliber to. Apparently the lighter loads (155 grain and lower weights) were opening like a parachute in outer layers of skin and not penetrating deeply enough to effect a stop or a kill. As long as it is loaded with a 165 (yeah I know, only 10 grains heavier than a 155 so go figure) or heavier projectile, I wouldn’t feel under-gunned carrying a .40, anymore.

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The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:46 pm

My granddad was a policeman in rural South Georgia. He was a big tough guy and didn’t normally wear a San Brown belt preferring to carry a 1903 Colt .32 automatic in a pocket holster. Breaking up an altercation one night, one of the combatants, a VERY LARGE man decided to attack him. He shot the guy seven times and still had to result to fisticuffs to effect the arrest. When he got home that night, he threw the gun in a drawer and never touched it again. The very next day he bought the then new biggest nickel plated.357 S&W he could find. He told my dad that just drawing the gun would stop eighty percent of criminals and the rest would stop after the application of a round or two.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 9:47 pm

DEFINITELY!!!!!

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:49 pm

I have the .32, it’s a lot of fun to shoot, I also have a six inch stainless S&W 686 in.357, you can guess which one is the go to gun.

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 9:51 pm

Understood, Colonel! I have fired those old Colt .32’s and they are a lot of fun to shoot, but no, I don’t think I would feel comfortable carrying one for anything more than backup to something larger. The accuracy of the ones I have fired was nothing short of amazing.

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:54 pm

Most reviewers say the accuracy is very good, I read one that described it as ” shoots the eyes out of a rabbit at fifty paces”. Modern ammo can make up for some of the failings but it’s still a little bullet. Either way, John Browning was a genius.

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:03 pm

I have wondered how modern ammo, designed for the little keychain guns like the Kel-Tec’s, would perform out of those longer-barrel guns such as the Colt. The last one I shot, a guy at the range offered to let me shoot his when he noted that I was shooting a Kel-Tec .32. It fed those little Gold Dots flawlessly.
I imagine they would open up out of the longer barrel just fine, but might have the “parachute effect” I noted with the lighter .40 loads.

As you noted, you won’t go wrong with the .357 Magnum, though.

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 10:09 pm

I had a chance to participate in a “shoot off” of sorts several years ago. I’m partial to Winchester silver tips. Don’t know how they’d feed but they do make it in .32

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:15 pm

Those are an “oldie-but-goodie”, Colonel! The Seecamp .32’s at one time were only designed to work with the Silvertips. Since then, I seem to recall reading that they accept Gold Dots or a similar load with good results.

I tried in vain a few years ago to learn the type of “hollow point” a local attorney used in defending an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting he was mentoring from an armed robber. Media accounts only noted it was a “hollow point” round and no mention of brand or style. He put three rounds from a Kel-Tec into the bad guy with fatal results. I always hoped one day I might have a chance meeting with him and get to ask him for that bit of info. Whatever he had, it worked.

Tazmaniac September 7, 2014 at 10:49 pm

Sorry, I was replying to your post on calibers above but somehow got here???

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:55 pm

Disqus is experiencing a lot of weirdness as of late. I was reading a comment earlier that was labeled as being from “oldcola” but later showed to be from “Yes, but”. I wish they would stick to a notification format and leave it be, such as they one they had about three versions ago, that let you know if anyone replied to any of your comments. It seemingly changes on a daily basis as of late.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:41 am

I once found a Marine Colonel lying face down in cowshit at a cousin’s farm. Apparently, he’d wandered through the desert all night, alone, drinking, and ended up there.

I woke him up and asked him if he was ok, and he answered “I want my mommy…” … in a deep voice.

Squishy123 September 7, 2014 at 10:34 pm

Plus with a 686 you can hit shit 100 yards way with little more than pointing it in the general direction of the target. My favorite pistol, 686+ in 4″.

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 10:36 pm

I’m good but not 100 yard good, I can bust skeet on a fence post at 50 yards though.

aikencounty September 8, 2014 at 11:19 am

686 ,combat trigger, serrated hammer, white outline adjustable rear sight, red ramp front side, 6 inch barrell, Brazilian wood grips, stainless steel.
I think thats the way Tim “Tool Time” Taylor would have built a pistol!
Mine shines even when it’s in the safe!

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 5:00 pm

I’ve carried mine in “combat” and would do it again without any second thoughts – mine doesn’t shine to brightly any more, a can of bowflauge took care of that (though it’s just about all worn off now). Gonçalo Alves combat grips, same white outline red ramp sights – the gun was just about perfect out of the box.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:36 am

Should have used a 9mm, and shot him 15 times.

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 7:09 am

Only metrosexual European communists carried 9mm back then.

Tazmaniac September 8, 2014 at 7:47 am

Why would you leave four rounds in the magazine? Are you poor or something?

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 9:52 am

Always leave 4 in case you miss – double tap for the wife, one for you, and one for your dog.

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:48 pm

Me, I’d rather see more sword play, less cannon fire.

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The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:51 pm

Ever swung a gladius or a saber? If you’ve ever seen what they can do to flesh, you’d probably prefer guns.

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 10:09 pm

Tai Chi Dao Sword: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dao_(sword)

My sefu says I’m almost ready to teach it ….

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 10:12 pm

Learned it a part of a history course I took years ago, a guy from Cold Steel spoke and demonstrated the effectiveness of various bladed weapons on pig carcasses – grotesque and awe inspiring all in one fell swoop.

Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 10:35 pm

Grotesque, certainly. And they are harder to conceal. Even the wooden instructional Dao swords are heavy and wicked.
(The Tai Chi Dao looks like the pirate movie sword … a big long meat cleaver. My favorite is hand-made of bird’s eye maple [like a pool stick], but weighs more than seven pounds. The steel ones weigh about the same.)

The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 10:44 pm

Have you ever tried Cold Steel’s practice swords? (No don’t get a commission). I have a gladius and a hand an a half I use when I do school presentations. The gladius is more fun to spar with than my broken.

FastEddy23 September 9, 2014 at 9:57 pm

Lisa Ka is my wife. She does practice Tai Chi sword play, but not the heavy duty military styles, only the basic health and defense type(s).

I wrote that logged on as Herself, but She (who must always be obeyed) allowed the above to remain as is … because it is true.

She does collect the wooden practice swords, but is not really into the steel. (Besides, if one is really up on the trip, the steel would just slow the artist down.)

The Colonel September 9, 2014 at 10:19 pm

The swords I’m taking about are made from some sort of indestructible plastic (my eleven year old loves the gladius and has tried to destroy it). They have a sword breaker and several boken in the collection. Here’s a link to their site but you can buy them cheaper at some of the larger online knife stores. http://www.coldsteel.com/Category/10_1/Trainers.aspx

FastEddy23 September 10, 2014 at 12:10 pm

Holy Cow! Expensive enough to keep children from equipping their own armies, cheap enough to replace hand guns. ( http://www.coldsteel.com/Category/38_1/Chinese_Styled_Swords.aspx )

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:35 am

Can you get one with a night scope and an effective range of 600 meters that can cut through 1/4″ standard steel plate?

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 7:10 am

Up all night?

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 9:50 am

Ninjas.

Tazmaniac September 7, 2014 at 10:32 pm

Why use the 45GAP? From what I’ve read its not worth the change. If muzzle flip is the problem, go with H & K and stick with the 45ACP. Lets be fair, it sounds like the driver took one while re-entering the car and the car shots were in the opened door. The description makes it sound like the pistol was just bucking wildly in the officer’s hand.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 10:49 pm

Glock was really pushing hard to get that cartridge (and the guns designed around it) into the marketplace. One of the ways gun manufacturers try to market a duty type weapon is getting as many state police, large departments, and capital police, agencies as possible carrying that gun. It doesn’t hurt to use those bragging rights in their ads, “used by LAPD, NYPD, Texas Dept of Public Safety, or whoever”. I believe they cut NY State Police, SCHP, and GAHP, deals to get those guns out there and on the market.

FNH was up against that issue when they cut a deal with Columbia to arm CPD with their sidearms. No major department was issuing their guns. They cut Columbia a deal (and no telling how much and to who under the table) to get CPD carrying their guns. Of course, the first batch had serious flaws which could result in the guns going into full auto while being fired and FNH wound up replacing the lot of them with newer guns. Most of the comments I’ve heard were good but have heard some reports of the ambidextrous mag releases causing dropped mags while on the range with some officers. That is not something I would want to be worried about if I found myself in a deadly force encounter.

Tazmaniac September 7, 2014 at 10:59 pm

Sounds like Glock response to better, smoother 45ACP brands out there. BTW, thanks for talking me into that USP a couple years ago, my Glocks are my reliable workhorses, but my 45 is my refined joy to shoot!

CorruptionInColumbia September 7, 2014 at 11:02 pm

Glad you are enjoying it, Taz! Did you ever get your holster situation straightened out to your satisfaction?

Tazmaniac September 7, 2014 at 11:19 pm

Found a real nice SigTac paddle w/ Blackhawk style retention. I’m like a duck to water with those types. I don’t know what all fuss is about, only an idiot could draw those w/ their finger in the guard, or you were born w/ a birth defected trigger finger? Like 45 degree bend?

Dan Hendrix September 7, 2014 at 9:07 pm

So if you do not agree with a law, you feel that you should disregard it and keep on trucking? A guy wants to rape your wife, because he does not believe rape should be illegal, is that ok with you? What a group of idiots, feel free to not wear your seat belt and some officer will gladly scrape what is left of you off the tree.

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EJB September 8, 2014 at 8:08 am

They won’t do it gladly, it actually bothers cops to see people die senselessly because they were to stupid to wear a seat belt.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 9:28 am

There is a huge difference in committing a violent crime against another, such as the rape scenario you describe, and not taking a precaution which endangers primarily oneself.

A lot of things that common wisdom says are good for us and in keeping with the ideas of living long and healthy lives are not always adhered to by many in the population for one reason or another. Yeah, we should all; wear rubbers, not smoke, not drink to excess (even at home), exercise, watch what we eat, drink at least 8 glasses of water a day, and many other things. This does not mean that the nanny state should be able to mandate those things to us under penalty of being stopped, badgered, and harassed with a fine and a court appearance for not doing these things as we should.

While I do wear my seatbelt every time I get in the car, I don’t feel that the nanny state should put itself in the position of being arbiter of what I must do for my own good and not in such cases. Which of those things I listed will be next on their list of things they force me to do for my own good?

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Dan Hendrix September 8, 2014 at 10:04 am

If this applied only to you I would say go ahead but when the accident comes, and it will, it will still be up to emergency services to clean up the carnage. Yes my example of rape is extreme, but still valid, as you feel any law you don’t adhere to, as not valid, ergo that rapist and child molester has same mind set you do. I spent 37 years dealing with people with your values, mostly notifying next of kin. Walk a mile in the real world and then criticize. Btw a Greenville Police officer lays in hospital, shot by a person who had killed 3 people, the officer did not know of the 3 murders, but suspect did. When you are stopped, you should accept ticket, contest in court if you like.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 10:11 am

Maybe I did the same, for not quite so long. Even so, I realize that there are so many laws, TOO many in fact, that it is impossible for the average cop to enforce them all. The frivolous ones, those with common sense will learn to let go in favor of dealing with the real criminals and the ones who cause genuine harm in this world. I hope the Greenville officer makes a full recovery. Glad the POS bought the farm, its just a shame he didn’t do it before he took three innocent people out and injured the officer.

I do agree with your last sentence.

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Scrappy September 9, 2014 at 12:00 am

Small towns and counties have budgeted “ticket money” forever. As the legislature continues to waste our money, Police are forced to write a larger volume of tickets to keep up with the assessments that impact their local govt. budgets. 17 state agencies are funded thru traffic tickets. Every time the legislature gets in a cash crunch, which is frequent, they take a little bit more of the “ticket money” from local govt. Local govt. does not want to raise taxes so the only alternative is to make their cops write more tickets to balance the budget. What a great source of revenue for the state!

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:25 am

So if you do not agree with a law, you feel that you should disregard it and keep on trucking?

——-

When your conscience says law is immoral, don’t follow it. – Jack Kevorkian

Do you think he meant your conscience?

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Just following orders September 8, 2014 at 8:34 pm

The Nazi defense at Nuremberg didn’t work out for well either for the law enforcers, but it just goes to show that there’s no shortage of unthinking meat sacks available to carry out the orders of our masters.

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euwe max September 9, 2014 at 12:10 am

hate helps hone hitlers.

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Barbarossa September 7, 2014 at 9:08 pm

I hate the seat belt law. In fact, that Republicans joined Dems in pushing that big brother nonsense law is the tipping point as to why I no longer think of myself as a Repub. Seriously, Government has no business in protecting us from ourselves, and should they feel so, they need to grow some ball and ban motorcycling, hang gliding, roller coasters, etc, etc,. But of course, they know that America can only digest one lost freedom at a time.

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:47 pm

“… they need to grow some ball[s] and ban motorcycling, hang gliding, roller coasters, etc, etc, …”

That would be the “progressive” way.

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EJB September 8, 2014 at 8:06 am

It is accepted doctrine that “driving is a privilege not a right”, no court disagrees and no “rights” organization fights it. Being its a privilege and that seat belt laws literally save tens of thousands of lives each year its a good law. You may not like it but a goodly many mothers, fathers, brother and sisters are extremely thankful for those laws. If you are in a bad accident one day and the only reason you are wearing the seat belt is because of the cop that hides behind the bushes at the next stop light you will be thankful too. And if not the ones who love you will be.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:02 am

“It is accepted doctrine that “driving is a privilege not a right”,”

Even though I don’t agree with anything you said, you did correctly identify the problem.

I see it as a clear usurpation of the “Privileges and Immunities Clause” as ruled in Zobel vs. Williams.

But the government and modern day courts don’t give a shit about that anymore.

Apologists for the state will say that all hell will break loose even we don’t require driver licenses, similar to the drug war/law argument.

Just like feudal lords owned the people on the land they ruled over, the same is now in effect here. We are nothing more than tax cattle as things stand now.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:22 am

We are nothing more than tax cattle as things stand now.

——-
I was hoping for freedom fighters… or at least stealth consciousness abettors.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:24 am

Most people logically don’t tell the mugger pointing the gun at them “No, I’m not paying.”

Guilty as charged on the last though, but ture patriotism can be downright stupid as times-and I hate being stupid and try to avoid it at all costs…sometimes unsuccessfully.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 10:32 am

Serious question, how else would you have it. In an accident with fatalities the offending driver is/can be charged with manslaughter or other such offenses. With the seat belt requirement, in many cases, the fatality is removed and the charges are less. It is an undisputed fact that seat belts save lives. There are 30% fewer lives lost today than 40 years ago despite a 49.3% increase in the population. Granted there are other factors contributing but seat belts do save lives.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:37 am

“Serious question, how else would you have it.”

First, whether someone is required to show their papers or not has no bearing on whether they can be prosecuted for their crimes. They are two totally separate issues.

Second, if you’d like the government to start protecting people from their own stupid behavior based on statistics, I’d suggest you start with something that’s a much bigger and worth while:

Out law cigarettes(we are getting close anyway)
Ban the “Big Gulp” for all the fatties
No more all you can eat buffets if your BMI says your “obese”

You get the picture Hoss?

I myself prefer freedom. But, if you want to codify jail time for stupidity I expect are globe leading incarceration rates will go up even higher, if that’s imaginable.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 1:17 pm

Well, Hoss, since you seem to be one of those “all or nothing” types let’s take it to the logical extreme;
-Why have medical/physical requirements for pilots?
-Why have a minimum age for consent of sexual relations?
-Why have the multitude of OSHA regulations?

There is a line in nearly everything where government has a limit set by the people through their representatives. We want to be protected from pilots with bad hearts, we want our children protected from predators until at least 16 years of age (used to be 13 until a few years ago) and we want to force companies to force their employees to follow safety procedures and wear safety equipment (even though most don’t want to). With regards to automobile drivers I want them to have to wear seat belts, you do not, but my money says that if you obey the law and wear your seat belt and survive a horrible accident you will be mighty happy to see your grandchildren again. Draw the line where you want, get the law repealed or just do like some of the other dumb asses and just pull the seat belt across the front of you without fastening it. My grandchildren won’t miss you.

Yep! September 8, 2014 at 8:24 pm

Always the drama with you.

With the exception of the age of consent thing, corporations can handle their own business just fine and dandy without government interference.

As far as someone taking advantage of a young boy/girl, I’m also sure families can take of that business as well.

Enough of your cheerleading for the nanny state, just because you want & need it doesn’t mean everyone else does.

Put your big boy pants on.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 9:34 pm

1) You must have me confused with someone else which indicates you don’t know what you are talking about.

2) I have repeatedly argued for less regulation on business. Not less of regulations needed to protect people but less of the rent seeking / crony corporation regulations. Read the book “Broken Government” it’s digital and on Cato’s Web site for a great explanation of “rent seeking” and some good examples.

3) Yes, I can see why a twisted mind such as yours would champion vigilante justice. Problem is that just results in a breakdown of law and order, something you probably approve.

4) I don’t and haven’t cheered for the nanny state. If you bothered to remember any of my posts (or went back to look any up) you would find I am the opposite of what you accuse me. But that isn’t important to you, you just want to slander and silence any voice that is contrary to yours. I did state common and accepted doctrine which isn’t challenged by any organization using lawsuits, legislative action or activism.

Yep! September 9, 2014 at 11:06 am

“Problem is that just results in a breakdown of law and order, ”

That ships already left, sailor.

“I have repeatedly argued for less regulation on business.”

Liar:

“-Why have the multitude of OSHA regulations?”

“I don’t and haven’t cheered for the nanny state.”

Liar:

“With regards to automobile drivers I want them to have to wear seat belts”

“you just want to slander and silence any voice that is contrary to yours”

Wrong, I simply want to point out the truth, and your comments help me in doing that. So by all means, keep writing.

EJB September 9, 2014 at 1:30 pm

You are as full of shit as a Christmas goose.

CriticalMass September 9, 2014 at 2:47 am

Re: the seatbelt law, I believe it is a very good thing and people should be fully on board with it because belts do much more than “save you from yourself.”

If you need to brake and swerve to avoid an accident, or if you get hit and
spun around, belts keep you planted in the driver’s position so you can control your vehicle when things come back closer to normal. If you’re not belted, you can be thrown over to the passenger side and if that happens, you will probably lose contact with the brake pedal and possibly the steering wheel. This affects the safety of the vehicles near yours.

Also, the “thrown clear is safer in case of fire or going into water” claim is another myth, statistically. A driver (or passenger) is helped by *not* being belted in only one out of 10,000 serious accidents. So not wearing seatbelts is like playing Russian Roulette with a pistol that has one empty chamber out of 10,000.

Seatbelted drivers are safer themselves and make travel safer for other
drivers near them… their passengers are safer, too.

Ultimately, in the absence of the seatbelt law, we would all probably be paying more for auto and life insurance and there would be more deaths and serious injuries, so as much as I have libertarian tendencies, I think it’s a very bad idea to badmouth seatbelt laws.

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SC Political Digest September 7, 2014 at 9:16 pm

Dumb@$$#$ like FITS didn’t learn a D@*n thing from the bully-suspected murderer and so-called Gentle Giant. You idiots print the myths of the left..and then never mention it again, when you are made to look like the D@*n fools that you are…when the truth comes out…

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Scrappy September 7, 2014 at 9:26 pm

Will, you simply LOVE to stir the shit! Let me get this right….your SLED “source” and you deputy solicitor “source” said it was a bad shooting….but Dan Johnson is going to go against everyone and say it was justified? Why would he do this? Evidently there exist a video that shows what happened. You would have us believe that Dan Johnson would stick his neck out for a white trooper? Surely you jest!

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Let's see the vid! September 7, 2014 at 10:04 pm

The great thing is, Dan can simply release the video to end all speculation, right?

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Scrappy September 7, 2014 at 10:40 pm

Absolutely! The video will be released eventually.

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Let's see the vid! September 7, 2014 at 10:52 pm

You’d think they’d want to get it out there asap to nip anything in the bud(bad pun).

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Lisa Ka September 7, 2014 at 9:40 pm

“… hitting Jones once in the thigh and striking his vehicle four times. …”

New car, big state payout, justified. The victim should also ask for a signed letter of apology, suitable for framing and to show his grandkids.

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The Colonel September 7, 2014 at 9:47 pm

Payouts are capped in South Carolina at $300,000.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:34 am

$2500 in Iraq.

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The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 7:12 am

Less than that in Afghanistan if it was a woman, child or dog.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 9:50 am

We paid for dogs?

Halfvast Conspirator September 8, 2014 at 10:01 am

We paid for women?

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:15 am

yeah… we paid for women?

The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 5:02 pm

I’ve never paid for a woman – unless you consider the cost of an engagement ring paying…

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:18 pm

That’s the installment plan.

Ed September 8, 2014 at 7:44 am

I don’t think payouts are capped in a section 1983 action.

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The Colonel September 8, 2014 at 8:03 am

Not sure – the Federal gubamint would have to get involved so maybe not – tough to prove the police officer shot him to “deprive him of his civil rights” though.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:06 am

the fondling fathers never imagined things like breathing and privacy would be so difficult to acquire for minorities and counter culturists in our modern age.

Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:26 am

“fondling fathers”

Nicely done.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 5:15 pm

“fondling fathers”

Those who hold nothing sacred are nothing to behold.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:17 pm

This is my rifle this is my gun
this is for fighting, this is for fun

EJB September 8, 2014 at 7:57 pm

Well, that’s a start.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 8:00 pm

Soon I’ll be a fondling father, too.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 8:11 pm

You converting to Islam?

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 8:15 pm

Gun collecting.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 8:20 pm

Ahhh, much better endeavor.

No decoder ring needed September 8, 2014 at 8:30 pm

I love me some cracker jack philosophy.

EJB September 8, 2014 at 9:01 pm

I gots more.

Really? September 7, 2014 at 10:14 pm

You know the biggest problem with this entire case? The media! They refuse to let a good story get in the way of the facts. Why not find out the facts before reporting all hype and making it racial? How many times have they said in the media that the Trooper has fired his gun before but failed to mention that the man who was shot actually had an active warrant? If the Trooper is guilty of something wrong let’s get the real story before we tar and feather him in in the News media.

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Petunia September 7, 2014 at 10:55 pm

Lance Corporal C.M. Groubert of the S.C. Highway Patrol should be in big trouble!
FIVE SHOTS AND ONLY ONE HIT AT CLOSE RANGE??? He needs practice!

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Tazmaniac September 7, 2014 at 11:09 pm

A little bit of experience is telling me to expect it to show a hit on Jones and rest in the door he is behind. People, running back to a vehicle after being approached by LE is not too smart. My guess is Jones was was nervous because of his unresolved issues and wasn’t thinking clearly.

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Limbaughsaphatkhunt September 7, 2014 at 11:13 pm

Good to see the usual suspects about…acting as apologists for a cop who clearly represents yet another example of shooting an unarmed minority without cause.

Just come out of the closet and embrace your racism already. You know you all think black people are untermenschen but you’re too much of a pussy to actually have the balls to declare it.

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CorruptionInColumbia September 8, 2014 at 12:29 am

Damn man, ya got me! I’ve been outed now. What I haven’t figured out is how this Trooper was able to hold back and constrain himself from shooting any of the thousands of other minority people he surely encountered before Mr Jones.
I guess he just couldn’t contain his hatred any longer and it finally came out.

(sarcasm font out)

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:08 am

What I haven’t figured out is how this Trooper was able to hold back and constrain himself from shooting any of the thousands of other minority people

——-
plausible deniability?

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Smirks September 8, 2014 at 8:46 am

acting as apologists for a cop who clearly represents yet another example of shooting an unarmed minority without cause.

Clearly? Here’s what I see in this thread so far.

-People defending the cop “because cops never do anything wrong.”

-People defending the cop “because REEEFER MAAAADNESS!” and “because innocent until proven guilty is for chumps.”

-People defending the cop “because niggers.”

-People attacking the cop due to poor aim. (Agreeable in that stray bullets pose a danger to bystanders, regardless of whether cop is right or wrong.)

-People defending the suspect even though there is no real evidence to look at.

-People who want to see more evidence.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:05 am

Some people just think the uniform is *smokin’ hot*!

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urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 11:32 am

Oh, I fully admit I consider them untermenschen…….my eyes have been open for a long time.

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urbantrout September 7, 2014 at 11:21 pm

Sheeit, mofo! I bees prayin dis wuz a bad shootin, soz I kin snag me a new flat-screen an sum Air Jordans! Gnomesayin?

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:33 am

Did it take you long to invent this type of reply?

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Smirks September 8, 2014 at 8:31 am

Nope, the commenters that regularly visit Stormfront and Chimpout and other various white supremacist websites can come up with these comments rather quickly.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 9:43 am

It must be part of a repertoire that they spend copious time developing. It’s like a 2nd round of auto didactic education for them.

Too bad that didn’t choose to broaden their vocabulary in a pursuit that would make them more money/productive.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:02 am

…as he sat in the dentist chair, beginning to feel the effects of the gas, he noticed the computer in the corner was displaying the Stormfront homepage….

Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:04 am

lol….if you find a dentist that is an avid read of Stormfront I’ll truly be astounded. (and feel bad for being an optimist)

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:13 am

Look carefully at your dentist’s teeth – if he’s wearing dentures, or a dental appliance… he might be a Stormfront member… if his tattoos look like broken crosses and burning skulls… he might be a Stormfront member.. if his hair is shaved, or blue and spiked.. he might be a Stormfront member… if he’s carrying a gun in the office… he might be a Stormfront member… if the reading material in the waiting room includes “Soldier of Fortune”… he might be a Stormfront member…

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 11:31 am

Odd that you’d think one must be a Stormfront member to admit the Negro has been the most pernicious and destructive force to ever plague this nation. You can’t even look at sub-Saharan Africa and see how these semi-evolved savages live, left to their own devices.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 11:53 am

Nah… you’re a Stormfront member, and you don’t admit the Negro has been the most pernicious and destructive force to ever plague this nation.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 10:05 pm

No, I’m not a member yet, but I might join if I can get one of those cool black Allegemeine SS uniforms out of the deal. Thanks! ( I already have a 1937 P08 Luger, so I’m good there.)

euwe max September 9, 2014 at 12:07 am

You should look into it… there’s nothing as satisfying as *sharing* a point of view with a like-minded audience.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 11:31 am

Odd that you’d think one must be a Stormfront member to admit the Negro has been the most pernicious and destructive force to ever plague this nation. You can’t even look at sub-Saharan Africa and see how these semi-evolved savages live, left to their own devices.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 9:54 am

I’d think they’d have to go on life support to switch that much brain power over to thinking.

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urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 11:26 am

Nope! Just like Jane Goodall, I observe the species in it’s natural environment and develop an ear for their unique primate vocalizations.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 11:54 am

So you’re a woman.

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urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 12:06 pm

You seem to have comprehension problems.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 3:35 pm

Don’t worry, it’s just your anosognosia. Any frustration you may feel now will go away quickly.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 9:57 pm

Sorry, I’m fully aware…..why don’t you take your white-guilt liberal ass down to some Section 8 housing after midnight and walk around a bit?

euwe max September 9, 2014 at 12:06 am

Sorry, I’m fully aware…..why don’t you take your white-guilt liberal ass down to some Section 8 housing after midnight and walk around a bit? I’d advise you to take a handgun, but I’m pretty sure you’re scared of one.

——
I’ll say this for you – you can spell!

Stupendous September 8, 2014 at 8:26 pm

“You seem”

I know another idiot that uses similar phraseology.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 9:55 pm

“you seem” is an unusual turn of phrase for you? I’m taking it English isn’t your first language.

Stupendous September 8, 2014 at 10:06 pm

Having trouble distinguishing similar from unusual? Perhaps English isn’t your first language.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 10:18 pm

Sorry you’re right. Myself and your unnamed friend are the only humans to ever utter the words “you” and “seem” together. It’s a good thing breathing in an autonomous function of a simple brain stem, or you’d have died of hypoxia long ago.

euwe max September 9, 2014 at 1:34 am

Myself and your unnamed friend are the only humans to ever utter the words “you” and “seem” together.

——–
Is that a fact?

Stupendous September 9, 2014 at 10:55 am

Well, at least you admitted you were wrong. So there’s hope for those that have survived hypoxia.

urbantrout September 8, 2014 at 10:23 pm

How misogynist and un-PC , for a leftie moonbat.

euwe max September 9, 2014 at 12:08 am

I’m pretty amazing, aren’t I? I cross those invisible lines with an almost cult-like abandon.

Mike at the Beach September 7, 2014 at 11:40 pm

I don’t even have the energy to get into all of the weird holes in the FITS angle here, other than to say that it will very likely be proven to be untrue silliness. I have ZERO info other than what’s been published in the papers, but common sense says that if a white trooper goes nuts and blows away a black dude (and his car) for forgetting his wallet in a predominantly black neighborhood just a few weeks after the Ferguson madness, the black (elected) Solicitor in a heavily Democratic circuit with lots of black political influence would *probably* not be the first cat jumping in front of SCHP to take that kick in the nuts. Just kind of makes sense, no? As for the ranting about the damn seat belt law and our inviolable Constitutional right to roll around on tax-funded highways without wearing one, there’s an easy way to defeat all of those evil cops being able to stop you and scratch out that ticket…you could just suck it up and wear the seat belt (which is overwhelmingly more likely to save your ass in a high speed collision than it is to ever do anything more negative than wrinkle your suit jacket). Law enforcement doesn’t need the seat belt primary enforcement to pull us over- they can *always* find a reason to pull us over (rolling stop, couple MPH over the limit, blinker not on in time, etc.). FITS continues its rapidly accelerating descent down the rabbit hole…

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EJB September 8, 2014 at 7:56 am

Disqus only allows one up vote so I’d like to add two more here +2.

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CriticalMass September 9, 2014 at 2:16 am

Yup, I’ll add a few positive votes, too… and I see no hate in Mike’s posts.

Re: the seatbelt law, it is needed and people should be on board with it because belts do much more than “save you from yourself.” If you need to brake and swerve to avoid an accident, or if you get hit and spun around, belts keep you planted in the driver’s position so you can control your vehicle when things come back closer to normal. If you’re not belted, you can be thrown over to the passenger side and if that happens, you will probably lose contact with the brake pedal and possibly the steering wheel.

Also, the “thrown clear is safer in case of fire or going into water” claim is another myth, statistically. A driver (or passenger) is helped by *not* being belted in only one out of 10,000 serious accidents. So not wearing seatbelts is like playing Russian Roulette with a pistol that has one empty chamber out of 10,000.

I realize this does not speak to whether this was a good shoot… but seatbelted drivers are safer themselves and make travel safer for other drivers near them in cases like in the first paragraph. Their passengers are safer in those cases, too.

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Willie Bottoms September 26, 2014 at 10:10 pm

I am a seat belt survival of a very bad car accident 3 times. Once when I was in high school and we were hit from behind with the other car going over 100 miles per hour. Once when I was driven off the road going over 35 miles an hour hitting a tree coming from a Thanksgiving dinner. Once from getting hit from the side when someone was speeding to rush somewhere. Each time this seat belt law saved my life. Although I have constant pain with my back and left side of my body from the impact, at least I am still alive.

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Mason McDaniel September 25, 2014 at 5:01 pm

“I don’t even have the energy to get into all of the weird holes in the FITS angle here, other than to say that it will very likely be proven to be untrue silliness.”

Wow. Were you wrong.

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Mike at the Beach September 25, 2014 at 8:54 pm

I’m not sure what’s weirder, your nanny-nanny-boo-boo comment or upvoting yourself.. I’ll call it a tie.

The gist of my argument was against the FITS conspiracy theory that our African American Solicitor from a heavily African American-influenced circuit was going to somehow mount and sustain a secret campaign to defend the trooper if it turned out that the shooting wasn’t good just weeks after the Ferguson madness. The obvious inference there being that the political pressure would simply be too great to let that happen. Guess what? It was. That big conspiracy to cover for the trooper if the shoot went south? Didn’t happen. I’ll let you go back an re-read my comment- see if you can find in there where I said that the trooper was innocent, or that I somehow knew the shooting would turn out clean. I can save you the 20 minutes it would likely take you to read it- it’s not there.

I will not upvote myself attendant to this discussion. Namaste.

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Hello September 8, 2014 at 8:07 am

So are you implying that Leroy Smith may cause the trooper to update his resume?

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Smirks September 8, 2014 at 8:18 am

describing the incident as a “clean shot.”

A clean shot of what, the vehicle?

Who the hell justifies deadly force on a guy walking back to his car?

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LD September 8, 2014 at 9:08 am

There is a difference between “policing” and “law enforcement”. Unfortunately, most think they are one in the same.

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gregorybgeddings September 8, 2014 at 9:49 am

I stopped reading when the “liberal mainstream media” comment was puked up…

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:39 am

Why? That’s when it gets really entertaining!

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:26 am

The key to happiness is to suffer fools gladly.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:33 am

Unless they are fools trying to pump 5 rounds into you.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:38 am

You’ll still be happy – but maybe not for long.

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Yep! September 8, 2014 at 10:39 am

lol…is there a certain amount of physical pain that makes the task impossible?

You probably made a good point despite the answer.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:43 am

Another strong argument for legalizing pain killers.

euwe max September 8, 2014 at 10:52 am

Is not wearing your seat belt in a private parking lot a civil or criminal violation?

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whatsayu September 8, 2014 at 10:59 am

Not criminal in either case. 56-5-6540… A violation of this article does not constitute a criminal offense.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 11:02 am

I guess since the perp was attempting to use his car to kill the officer, it was a righteous shoot, though… a felony in progress.

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EJB September 8, 2014 at 5:13 pm

The story in “The State” newspaper, online edition, said the trooper lit him up on the street and Mr. Jones pulled into the store’s parking lot.

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euwe max September 8, 2014 at 5:18 pm

Hmm… I wonder which story is “the story.”

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EJB September 8, 2014 at 7:56 pm

Inquiring minds want to know.

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TSIB September 8, 2014 at 5:47 pm

“thanks to South Carolina’s primary enforcement law”

Thanks to your former boss, Mark Sanford.

How quickly we forget.

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euwe max September 9, 2014 at 1:39 am

hate you feel a seat belt violation is not worth a stop. Been to many a fatal where the difference was a seat belt not being worn.
—–
I’ll bet this guy is against national health care, but thinks nothing of being taxed for the preventative step of helping poor black folks to remember to put on their seat belt by stopping them on the street, and entering into a confrontation that could very well be fatal.

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Wondering September 12, 2014 at 10:53 am

Hmmmmm….is it about time for a late Friday afternoon news dump on this so it can buried over the weekend with all the other current events?

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Nice one September 19, 2014 at 12:51 pm

Looks like above prediction was one Friday early.

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Toast September 19, 2014 at 1:35 pm Reply
black panther September 25, 2014 at 8:45 am

I am going to be a police officer an stop every white cracker left an right an see how feels.

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Grippertoken September 25, 2014 at 9:55 am

“Thanks to South Carolina’s primary enforcement law (championed by the liberal mainstream media),”

Thats when I stopped reading and decided to never come back to this website.

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HenriHelvetica September 25, 2014 at 10:54 am

for all who doubt the actual account, here you go. Now you figure it out.

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/crime/2014/09/25/dnt-trooper-shooting-dash-cam.wis.html

from being asked to produce wallet to getting shot @ x6. Where was the justifiable force?? No where. The victim didn’t even have time to turn around to produce his ID. Yes – he should have been fired, do hope he sees plenty of jail time.

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Mark April 25, 2015 at 7:55 pm

Kid settled for $285,000, should have sued for more. Groubert needs to get life. Coward.

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