SC

SC Gambling Poll In The Field

The issue of casino gambling on the coast of South Carolina is being tested in a poll of registered voters in the state, sources tell FITS.  Details regarding the survey – including who is doing the polling and who is receiving the answers – were not immediately available. “It asked…

The issue of casino gambling on the coast of South Carolina is being tested in a poll of registered voters in the state, sources tell FITS.  Details regarding the survey – including who is doing the polling and who is receiving the answers – were not immediately available.

“It asked for my view on the governor’s race, the U.S. Senate races, casino gambling on the coast, video poker and the lottery,” a source who received the call tells FITS.

Specifically, the poll is said to ask whether respondents thought it was fair for government to ban private sector gaming “while running its own gambling operation in the form of the lottery.”

The poll also reportedly asked about the possibility of a third-party gubernatorial candidacy based around the gambling issue.

S.C. Gov. Nikki Haley has been a stalwart opponent of any private sector gambling in the Palmetto State. In fact she killed a 10,000-job project in the South Carolina Lowcountry on the basis of her moral objection to gambling.

Of course Haley has eagerly spent hundreds of millions of lottery dollars on nonsense like this … 

And this …

Democratic candidate Vincent Sheheen hasn’t taken a position on the issue.

This website supports the full legalization of all forms of gambling in South Carolina – and rejects ongoing efforts by government to solidify its monopoly over this sector of the economy.

“Our state can take a major step forward in terms of enhancing its competitiveness and employing more of its citizens by immediately legalizing private sector gambling,” we wrote recently.

Unfortunately, Haley remains adamantly opposed to the notion and there seems to be limited legislative appetite to do anything to defy her.

Oh well … in the event someone sends us the results of this survey, we’ll be sure to pass them along.

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25 comments

Jackie Chiles November 7, 2013 at 2:44 pm

I’m not really a fan of video poker because I didn’t like having to squeeze past the dregs of society every time I wanted to get a coke from the inside of a gas station.

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Frank Pytel November 7, 2013 at 4:22 pm

Same with the fracking lottery. New Statute: Every store selling this crap must bump these people to the back of the line so people that have a job can get back to paying the checks of the welfare mama’s that buy this crap.

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Same ol' Same ol' November 8, 2013 at 7:49 pm

That is one of the most annoying things. Damn, all I want is my big belly washer and these fuckers are trying to cash in and buy all kinds of scratch offs. A fucking tax on those who ain’t good at math.

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Halfvast Conspirator November 7, 2013 at 3:26 pm

Go ahead and do it, it is a tax on the stupid. But then everyone else will get taxed to give the losers all the assistance they will need once they are broke.

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Jackie Chiles November 7, 2013 at 3:43 pm

Round and round it goes. Basically the government will make $100 million taxing video poker. Then spend an extra $200 million to give necessities to people who wasted their paychecks on video poker.

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EJB November 7, 2013 at 4:05 pm

Gambling causes more problems than it solves and ruins more lives than it makes better.

Also, originally, Vegas then Atlantic City, the casinos were private money. Even some of the early Indian casinos were private money, but more and more these “private” casino developers are seeking more and more “public” money. I have in the past expressed that the market for casinos is actually beginning to become saturated and below is a link to a report written for an organization called “The Council of State Governments”. Its an eye opener, already massive tax dollars flowing towards casinos.

An article on Casinos
http://knowledgecenter.csg.org/drupal/content/casinos-revenues-are-dicey-situation

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MashPotato November 7, 2013 at 7:11 pm

Government either taxes, subsidizes, or bans all human activity. When it comes to gambling, they do all three! Why can’t they just leave people alone?

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Libby Mitchell November 8, 2013 at 4:24 pm

A very near-sighted comment…By leaving people ‘alone’ regarding gambling, MashPotato…the taxpayer pays way too much to fix the problems the addicts and their beloved gambling industry collectively create. Innocent people like small business retailers are crushed in the casino gambling process! Way too many jobs are lost in other industries! WHY should society allow one rapaciously destructive industry to so savagely COST all others, by ‘leaving it alone’? Not enough people are masochists, to put up with that!

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MashPotato November 8, 2013 at 4:41 pm

That response would earn you an A in any public high school economics class.

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Libby Mitchell November 8, 2013 at 6:03 pm

Is that as far as you got then MashPotato? I have yet to see one top quality, peer-reviewed and independently researched study that says differently…Indeed my claims have been soundly backed by studies throughout the world… but I guess they only get read and understood at university or afterwards! Read up and come back later! Have a good day.

MashPotato November 8, 2013 at 8:51 pm

Glad to see you enjoy your cozy corner of the echo chamber. It must collect a wealth of positive reinforcement and confirmation bias.

There are plenty of studies, sound economic theory, and real world evidence that support the claim that people behave best when left alone. The difference lies in the conclusions. My theory concludes that liberty is good for everyone. Yours concludes that everyone needs told what to do and how to do it.

Libby Mitchell November 8, 2013 at 9:42 pm

Let’s not get into a long ‘social justice / rights vs responsibilities’ argument here, MashPotato?

Apart from deflection on the issues that I raised, your answer is limited on the aspect you raised yourself. Casinos / slot machines etc are hardly in the realm of ‘safe pursuits’ and leaving the casino industry OR any user of it ‘alone’ to get on with their gambling activities, is most unlikely to make either a casino OR its patrons “behave best”, at all? Sometimes we need strong regulation. Regulation that works! If we cannot manage that we should BAN the pursuit…for the sake of other innocent citizens.

Your argument falters when we compare any other hazardous pursuit eg flying, driving. Should ‘any Tom, Dick or Harry’ be left to leap into a plane and fly, with no careful regulation or license? If drivers ‘behave best when left alone’ why do we have road police, speed checks and breathalyzers etc? Your emotive appeal to ‘liberty’ is miss-placed here when discussing casinos and their use of addictive products. It is spin. Rubbish.

My theory is that liberty is good for everyone..so long as their activity does NOT harm others severely. In this case people outside the casino, get harmed MOST. That includes the business operators [who will go broke], the families [whose assets are depleted] and the taxpayers [who ultimately pay the casino social costs] and you well should know it, if you read widely the many research studies that have shown how much a casino impacts negatively on any society, right now.

DO not come the nanny-state / moral zealot line…it does not suit the casino gambling issue at all. NO business should be allowed to use dangerous products that will ultimately harm people… and get away with it freely, especially when those MOST harmed did not even use the product themselves?

Read up on “passive smoking and citizen rights” to see what I mean. We need strong laws to balance everyone’s rights in my opinion. You are using emotional arguments that have no sound basis here. It is is time to use intellect and common sense instead.

Why do you think that so many people are now voting to BAN casinos in their local areas? Surely you do not think that so many people could merely be ignorant ‘nanny-staters’? More likely…your arguments could be seen to be ‘spoiled brattish’! Face it…the majority of citizens who want casinos gone is growing, because people are waking up at last! When will you do that?

MashPotato November 8, 2013 at 11:35 pm

Waking up? I fell asleep six times before finally finishing this long response, which I recall began with an appeal to keep it short.

Are the fine citizens of Reno, Atlantic City, and Las Vegas going hungry because the soulless, oppressive casinos ran them into the ground? Hardly.

There’s one regulation that works better than anything your imagination can conjure: don’t go to casinos! But that can’t be a solution as it doesn’t punish the majority of casino patrons who gamble responsibly.

They know every game is stacked for the house. They accept the losses because it’s fun and entertaining. It’s no different than if you were to go to an arcade.

Why aren’t you similarly outraged at state-sanctioned gambling?

The really disgusting part of your theory, and also a factor in my conversion from liberal to libertarian, is that you think that other people are so stupid that they don’t and won’t ever know what’s good for them. You and your select few liberal and/or democrat friends are the only ones smart and caring enough to protect them from themselves. Because they’re so stupid, their opinions don’t count, unless of course they correspond with your own. That’s why you so smugly bragged about your academic echo chamber- you thought, and probably still think, you are talking to your intellectual inferior.

As you can see, I can hang with the best of them. Your degree and my lack of one mean nothing here. I have slain greater dragons than thee.

The call for liberty is much more than emotional. It is a rational, compassionate, and more sincere service to humanity than any idea that has come before or after it.

(drops mic)

Libby Mitchell November 9, 2013 at 12:44 am

MashPotato?… You referred to educational level. I responded to your point. I do not care how far you studied…though arguments that remain more objective are always more pleasant to hold in my view.

I am not talking about the gamblers themselves, though I am aware that addiction means “not being able to accept responsibility any more”, so why you presume that the skill of ‘making a rational choice’ is equally available for all gambling patrons, is beyond me. This is not to do with stupidity…but mental ill-health. Casino-goers do NOT have equal chance. An addict CAN’T decide logically…so maybe do not presume it.

I am talking of the consumer spending dollars that by one means or another, mostly foul means in my opinion based on research findings re slot machines…are fed disproportionately into ‘casino recreation’ that can cost $1200 an hour spending quite easily. OTHER citizens eg shop keepers miss out too much. Would you see a town’s shops mostly ruined by gambling? I can show you quite a few! The pawn shops are the success stories. Where are the small boutiques?

$1200 / hour is very high recreational spending and many more people suffer from that level of casino over-spending than is ever admitted. That in turn places pressures on innocent others…for whom there is NO luxury of liberty that you so loftily uphold. Other citizens are FORCED to then cover the losses that were created by gamblers, whether those gamblers lost self-control, admitted to addiction, or not.

Atlantic City is an excellent example and yes…I do believe that a lot of people eg business owners have been ‘run into the ground’ by casinos there. Sorry to disagree.

No matter what you say MashPotato…your call for ‘liberty’ should not mean ‘freedom to harm others’…and that is exactly what casinos advocate, support and pay lip service to avoiding! Do not blame me for saying it. There is a whole new surge of citizens all saying that now too. Have you not heard?

I am sure you must be employed to write this stuff. Or do you seriously think that all of the people who dislike casinos, have got it all wrong?

MashPotato November 9, 2013 at 3:43 am

Thanks for the flattery, but I work for a living.

People who don’t like casinos don’t have it all wrong, but you do if you presume that they all support banning them. Most people are reasonable enough that they can tolerate the existence of a casino without ever visiting one. Some of them are even capable enough to get help for loved ones suffering from gambling addiction! Imagine that, people taking care of each other all on their own… as if it’s human nature!

I was pleased to hear you value objectivity. Let’s observe objectively the effects of banning a business, even if it’s an evil, does-more-harm-than-good-therefore-should-be-banned casino. First effect is the capital that would be invested isn’t. Banks, real estate, and construction sectors have been cheated out of the opportunity. Second effect is the people who need jobs are deprived of an opportunity. The third effect is the customers are deprived of the product or service. You probably don’t care about denying a service you proclaim to be harmful, and so is precisely why you shouldn’t be a part of this decision making process to begin with. The fourth effect is that future growth and development of the community is stifled because business attracts businesses. I’ve personally witnessed gas stations, restaurants, barber shops, and retail stores open up anticipating and following the opening of a brand new casino in my home state of Louisiana. The fifth effect is that those who you think you are helping are not getting the help they need. Just because they don’t have a nearby casino to go to doesn’t mean their addiction goes away. Instead, they play the state lottery, scratchoffs, cards with friends and/or strangers (which could be worse than any casino), or they’ll just drive a little further to go to another casino. And when they so desperately need your compassion and support, when they need you to tell them they need to seek therapy for their addiction, you have no sense of responsibility because you already stopped the casino from being built. You’ve done your damage- I mean, part.

By the way, casinos have information and numbers to call for help with gambling addiction. Who’s the spoiled brat now?

I know you’re really worried about some poor soul blowing $1200/hr at some predatory casino. I have a similar concern about hospitals exploiting near-death senior citizens, in some cases charging millions of dollars to keep someone barely alive for a small number of very dramatic, excruciating days, weeks, and months.

Are you similarly concerned when someone having a mid-life crisis buys a sports car or a yacht? Should we ban yachts? Are you concerned when someone buys a $3600 tv in less than an hour? That’s three times the rate of your example!

What about when a woman buys a Gucci purse for $1200? Shopping addiction is prevalent and very serious. It affects families and marriages far more than than gambling ever will. Should we ban all Saks Fifth Avenues for rapaciously taking advantage of these poor addicts? After all, no one is at fault for their addiction!

I hate Saks Fifth Avenue and it would give me great satisfaction to see them all shutdown. Should I create a sob story and a moral high ground and use politics to achieve my bidding? I’m doing it because I care! Their families are the ones hurt the most!

Laws should treat all individuals and their respective businesses fairly. To do any different creates iniquity, which Bastiat reminds us is counter to the original purpose of the law. If you think casinos and gambling are so different that it requires a different set of rules, than you aren’t using your objective reasoning, which you claim to hold in high esteem.

There is no justification for controlling human behavior that doesn’t end with controlling humans. Controlling humans is slavery. Crack that nugget if you dare.

I enjoyed our back and forth on this issue. I feel that a respectful discourse with someone of a different political persuasion than you makes you stronger than talking with those of a similar philosophy. Exposing the weaknesses and flaws of your arguments, however easy, was a bit tiring to do on a smartphone. I hope you have one more response but this one is probably my last. See you around.

Mash

Libby Mitchell November 9, 2013 at 2:15 pm

Oh please MashPotato…Firstly casino building if banned, does not ‘finish the building industry’. Other building occurs instead. Please do not try to tell me that casinos are the only form of viable development around? In fact any other form of development would be more viable I would imagine? Secondly casinos only attract other business inside the casino usually. Gamblers spend relatively little on anything else but gambling mostly and addicts spend very little elsewhere, all around.

Cards at home, scratchies and lotteries have yet to hit the papers as being ‘the crack cocaine of gambling” like slots are known. Please do not compare apples and oranges? Why should exposing casino harms preclude me from relevant decision-making? That is a nonsense comment. Did you start it on your smartphone and could not be bothered deleting, so tried to make it sound clever?

Too many other points to answer individually MashPotato…save that every argument you outline eg shopping addiction is trivial in knock on effect and frankly is a ludicrous comparison. I am not trying to ban tiddly winks as a recreation, as I doubt people would die over it. How many suicides are “OK”…as result of slots for example?

Your own statement here shoots you in the foot though? You said, “There is no justification for controlling human behavior that doesn’t
end with controlling humans. Controlling humans is slavery.”

That IS my point. Casino products eg slots DO “control humans”…both the sadly over-spending humans that use them because the machines are so deadly-designed to get people to use them too much AND innocent others indirectly who then have to meet the devastating social costs and economic consequences of that slots over-spending.

Do you enjoy seeing small businessmen go broke because a casino stole their trade? Businesses that successfully traded for years have gone bust after casinos invaded their space and bled their previous customers dry. either directly or indirectly. The hairdresser no longer gets ladies in for high-end cut and colors etc…so she can no longer eat out at the local restaurant, so the restauranteur can no longer afford to go on holidays or to the dentist. Everyone suffers especially the tax office!

Not only have $$$billions been sucked into the nation’s casinos…so cannot be spent elsewhere in other local businesses…but casinos employ very few people [about 2-3 people for every $million taken] compared to other businesses [eg retail that employs 4-6 people for that same money]! Are you happy about creating a net LOSS in our overall community workforce…just so that you can enjoy seeing “freedom to harm” casinos doing it?

We banned drugs eg cocaine for safety reasons. It is time to do the same with casinos unless they can keep their patrons safer from over-spending. This is after-all a gambling industry problem to address! Let the gambling industry make safer products just like every other business has to! If it can’t do that…ban the products! Like we ban dangerous toys that choke kids! Seeya and nice chatting! Please do not feel obliged to reply. I am over this discussion too if you are! xoxo

Camel Jockey November 7, 2013 at 4:26 pm

The Mirage doesn’t have 10,000 employees. That would be a big casino in Jasper County.. Oh I know, the construction workers, the pawn shops, the limo drivers, blah blah blah. That thing was a dud from the get go.

However – lets get some horse tracks. Paramutal has a good vibe to it, it’s outdoorsy, its sporting. Maybe The Gypsy Queen would vote for camel races…import biz for the Port and all….stables, tractors, fencing, feed and seed. This would fit nicely with our agricultural base in that region. Most residents of SC have never even seen Hampton County, Jasper County, etc. Why should the opposition care, just continue to stay the hell away if you don’t like it.

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idcydm November 7, 2013 at 4:29 pm

Just like mass transportation, not enough population to support it.

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Same ol' Same ol' November 8, 2013 at 7:45 pm

Ya got to have money to bet. Most of them won’t be from here.

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Smirks November 7, 2013 at 4:32 pm

I still stand by my suggestion: Legalize gambling on a state-wide level with a year before it goes into effect, so that any local government (including Native American reservations) that wants to ban it can set up a vote to do so. Simple as that.

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Frank Pytel November 7, 2013 at 5:08 pm

Yeah right. The Res is going to ban ANY form of gambling. XP

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Steve Wynn November 8, 2013 at 9:22 am

It is pretty simple really. Just make zones for gaming. Two casinos at the Waccamaw Pottery/Hard Rock Park area and the other off of Hwy 278 where the previous development was proposed. MGM, Caesers, Wynn, etc. would kill to get down in the Myrtle Beach area. Plus there are already a ton of strip clubs over there so it isn’t like it would be bringing down the neighborhood. Both are close to airports, close to golf and close to tons of hotels and restaurants. The bible beating losers in the upstate will kill it because it makes to much sense.

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Jackie Chiles November 8, 2013 at 11:59 am

Nice how you worked religion bashing into your post. There’s not enough of that on the internet.

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euwe max November 9, 2013 at 6:48 pm

I prefer gambling indoors.

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Kami December 11, 2013 at 2:16 am

The “slot barns” of the ’90’s here in SC offered entertainment much more fun than scratching anything!! It made many jobs in Horry Co, helped the state , & gave hours of entertainment when there more than 2 machines in town to play!! “Cherry Master” had the best games!!

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