SC

Forbes: South Carolina Is A “Death Spiral” State

PALMETTO STATE HAS NATION’S SIXTH-HIGHEST RATIO OF “TAKERS” TO “MAKERS” “It’s a great day in South Carolina …” assuming you and your business are ready to enter a “death spiral.” As the national economy teeters on the edge of another full-blown recession, the Palmetto State is looking increasingly like a…

PALMETTO STATE HAS NATION’S SIXTH-HIGHEST RATIO OF “TAKERS” TO “MAKERS”

“It’s a great day in South Carolina …” assuming you and your business are ready to enter a “death spiral.”

As the national economy teeters on the edge of another full-blown recession, the Palmetto State is looking increasingly like a bad bet for capital investment.  South Carolina is one of eleven “Death Spiral States” according to Forbes magazine, which ranks it sixth in the nation in terms of its ratio of “takers” to “makers.”

“Two factors determine whether a state makes this elite list of fiscal hellholes,” the magazine notes.  “The first is whether it has more takers than makers. A taker is someone who draws money from the government, as an employee, pensioner or welfare recipient. A maker is someone gainfully employed in the private sector.”

The second factor employed by Forbes is a state’s credit worthiness, an independently calculated formula which “downgrades states for large debts, an uncompetitive business climate, weak home prices and bad trends in employment.”

S.C. Gov. Nikki Haley has bragged about creating tens of thousands of jobs since taking office, but most of those have been taxpayer-funded positions (i.e. government jobs) – or jobs lured with taxpayer-funded bribes.

In other words they are “takers,” not “makers.”

S.C. Sen. Tom Davis – a vocal critic of corporate welfare – says that South Carolina’s death spiral status means that next January’s gathering of the S.C. General Assembly will be an “incredibly important legislative session.”

“(We) need to turn things around,” Davis said.

***

Related posts

SC

Lowcountry ‘Defense of Democracy’ Leader Ousted Over Assassination Comments

Dylan Nolan
SC

‘Greenville’s Future’ Pushes Back Against Billion-Dollar Tax Hike

Will Folks
SC

Slow Down, South Carolina

Will Folks

66 comments

Roseanne November 26, 2012 at 11:21 am

Does anyone know how many of the “tens of thousands” of jobs Gov Haley has “created” actually have people working in them, and how many won’t really exist until some future time, if ever?

Reply
Smirks November 26, 2012 at 11:47 am

Still waiting for them 4,500 Walmart jobs, as everyone knows that will truly bring economic prosperity to this region!

Reply
jimlewis,owb November 26, 2012 at 11:23 am

Press release from the Gypsy Queen Governor:

Another Top Ten for South Carolina

It is indeed a Great Day in Carolina

Reply
Johnson November 26, 2012 at 11:35 am

Haley, McConnell, Leatherman, Courson, Harrell, Toal, and Alan Wilson. Your state’s top leaders. CorruptX3, CorruptX1, CorruptX5, Dumb, CorruptX4, CorruptX8 and Dumb.

Reply
Go Cocks! November 26, 2012 at 11:40 am

Just for clarification, the “taker count” in the article is:

“the number of state and local government workers plus the number of people on Medicaid plus 1 for each $100,000 of unfunded pension liabilities. Sources: the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the Kaiser Commission on Medicaid and a study of state worker pensions done in 2009 by two academics, Joshua Rauh and Rovert Novy-Marx.”

At least cut and paste the right paragraph when you plagiarize.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 11:54 am

It’s pure insanity to allow anyone other than net contributors to vote.

Even then I’m not sure that would fix anything.

Reply
SparkleCity November 26, 2012 at 12:06 pm

I guess that cuts off veterans/military retirees on military pensions and all those retired fuckers living on the coast from voting wouldn’t it???

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:08 pm

Yep.

If you choose to live off the taxpayers teat, whether it’s getting paid to kill people or not you should be calling the shots on how the money is spent.

It’s like letting employees decide how much the boss is gonna pay them.

Pure insanity.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:08 pm

edit: “SHOULDN’T”

Reply
vicupstate November 26, 2012 at 12:42 pm

If someone is working of the government either in military or civilian, provided they are doing their assigned duties, is just as much a contributor to society as a fully private-sector worker.

Does making a Big Mac serve society more, than perserving our liberties or fixing a pothole, or keeping a criminal behind bars?

? you are an idiot.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:45 pm

Well Vic, I think you’re an idiot too. So at least we have something in common.

:)

At least I can make the argument that he hamburger flipper earns his money through purel voluntary exchange on both sides of the transaction.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:45 pm

edit: “the” & “purely”

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:48 pm

“If someone is working of the government either in military or civilian, provided they are doing their assigned duties, is just as much a contributor to society as a fully private-sector worker. ”

Btw, I had to address that…without a private sector worker the first never exists. Ipso facto

Reply
Original Good Old Boy November 26, 2012 at 1:46 pm

I almost think there should be different voting “stock” so to speak. People who are contributors are allowed to vote for budgetary measures and taxing and spending. But everyone is allowed to vote on other matters, such as personal freedoms etc. Maybe have Senators control the finances, and the house control the rest, and different qualifications for voting for either.

Not sure how it would work, but I’m not comfortable disenfranchising everyone even if they don’t pay taxes.

But I’m also not comfortable with the continuing cycle of dependents continually voting to spend other people’s money on themselves.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 1:54 pm

Credit to you sir for at least thinking outside the box.

Clearly whatever you call what we have now in terms of “govt” is not working on both a state and national level.

Time for a new paradigm cause doing the same ole shit and expecting a different outcome is crazy/stupid.

Reply
Grumpy Cookie November 29, 2012 at 12:31 pm

So now you don’t like our constitution? Wait a minute…. let me a score card to keep up.

Reply
BigT November 26, 2012 at 11:57 am

Just like we MUST isolate ourselves from Obama to some degree, to thrive…the Earners in SC can stay away from the ‘Corridor of Shame’ democrat voters…

The strongest vote Conservative…and the cyclical impoverished and failing line up, election after election, and whore themselves out for Jim Clyburn, Steve Benjamin (who FITS likes) Gilda Cobb Salad and Robert Ford (who FITS likes)….

And if you point out their folly…the “Racist” charges fly…so they continue to be ignorant, mired in the feces and hate they choose for the children they have…for us to raise…

It’s simple…but takes courage to proclaim…we are Truly lacking Courage..and FITS is one of the most coward…

Reply
Jan November 26, 2012 at 12:09 pm

So Big T, who do you work for? Lets see how pure you are.

Reply
dwb619 November 26, 2012 at 6:58 pm

South Carolina gets more dollars from the fed than the state pays in via federal income tax.
Real nice for a red state. Course , if you look at the chart, virtually ALL of the blue states pay more into the federal tax than the state receives from the feds.
Ironic,isn’t it?
YOU BETCHA!
YOU BETCHA!

Reply
Frank Pytel November 27, 2012 at 7:11 am

Well Jan, I don’t see you stepping up with a company name and address. I at least have provided my real name, email and location. So WTF Big Mouth. Step up or shut up.

Have a Great Day!! :) There won’t be many left with the Republicrats and Demlicans in charge.

Frank Pytel

conservative for obama at gmail dot com

Reply
Jan November 26, 2012 at 12:07 pm

It seems fascinating that all people who work for the Government are labeled takers regardless of the service they provide (policemen, firemen, military personnel, road maintenance crews, trash collectors, etc), but all companies who receive Government Contracts are not. So if you are working for Boeing, you are a maker, even though your company would not exist without its defense contracts. If you are a doctor or a nurse you are a maker even though you probably would not have a job, if Medicare did not provide health insurance to 35% of your customers.

That said, I am glad we are looking to Forbes for some guidance as to how government should interact with business to produce a pro-growth environment. Please review Forbes list of Best Countries for Business. I’ll list the top ten.

New Zealand

Denmark

Hong Kong

Singapore

Canada

Ireland

Sweden

Norway

Finland

United Kingdom

Reply
Trevor Bauknight November 26, 2012 at 12:13 pm

I would happily move to eight of those ten to get out of this bass-ackward state. Every time I hear someone tout the virtues of devolving power from the federal government to the states, I think about what passes for governance in Columbia.

God help us all.

Reply
Crooner November 26, 2012 at 2:02 pm

Like.

Reply
hhuuhh?? November 26, 2012 at 6:53 pm

Jan, you make so much sense.
Too bad elected people like Tom Davis don’t and don’t even realize they are the takers.
If we could get rid of idiots like that in government, we could move forward.

Reply
Trevor Bauknight November 26, 2012 at 12:11 pm

Included among the takers? The state’s huge population of active duty and retired military personnel.

Moochers, all.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 12:32 pm

Nah, not “moochers”. Just not net contributors.

Not that it matters what I think, but if I was “benevolent dictator” you could probably convince me to allow the ones that were conscripted a vote.

But the ones that elected to be professional soldiers and payed accordingly simply shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

If they don’t like it they can do another job and be net contributors and vote.

Personally, if such a system were in place I have no doubt we wouldn’t want for professional soldiers under the right pay structure.

They aren’t “moochers” because at least they do something to earn their pay. Moochers might be those taking a welfare checking and doing nothing for it…if you care to be accurate.

Reply
scsince60 November 26, 2012 at 2:33 pm

How bout them Tigers!

Reply
Saluda Rapids November 26, 2012 at 4:10 pm

Exactly, scsince60. The real death spiral is in Death Valley. Luv Guv II can sure pick some winners.

Reply
Frank Pytel November 27, 2012 at 7:19 am

Yeah well. Sorry. I gotta disagree John. The military is clearly within the scope of the federal government. They are there to protect this country and I appreciate it, as I’m sure you do as well.

No, I’m not speaking of the last 500 “Police actions” or “Alqueda” BS. And I think that the vast majority of the military personnell would agree. They get sent off to some BS undeclared war in the name of the black savior or any other of his demlican and republicrat cronies. Yes Jan. Bushy too.

The military are absolutely producers. They produce an environment that allows free trade and security throughout the country. The citizenry votes the morons in that are consistently trying to give our freedoms to some one else at no cost or simply rob us of our freedoms.

The military get to vote in my world, except maybe a few of the war monger brass stars at the very top :P.

Have a Great Day!! :) There won’t be many left with the Republicrats and Demlicans in charge.

Frank Pytel

conservative for obama at gmail dot com

Reply
Torch November 27, 2012 at 10:13 am

@ By ? There hasn’t been any “conscription” or draft since 1972 if my memory is correct. Therefore, you wouldn’t give anyone a break. Skinned your ignorance again.

Reply
Frank Pytel November 27, 2012 at 10:25 am

That is incorrect. You must still register for the draft at the age of 18.

www . sss . gov / FSwho

Have a Great Day!! :) There won’t be many left with the Republicrats and Demlicans in charge.

Frank Pytel

conservative for obama at gmail dot com

Reply
? November 28, 2012 at 1:35 pm

“There hasn’t been any “conscription” or draft since 1972 if my memory is correct. Therefore, you wouldn’t give anyone a break. ”

That’s correct, so what, all the Vietnam veterans are dead?

Don’t be a moron.

Reply
Twinkie Ho-Ho November 26, 2012 at 12:27 pm

And exactly what is Tom Davis going to do?

Reply
Negro November 26, 2012 at 12:49 pm

We need to have a plan to put porch negroes back to work. They are a major drain on this state.

Reply
Godslayer November 26, 2012 at 1:01 pm

Also, S.C. needs to purge all the ignorant white trash and stupid racist rednecks.

Reply
Stephan November 26, 2012 at 1:34 pm

I’d say preppy GOP-butt kisser state employee types, their snooty wives and their brat kids from Lexington County are a bigger drain. Just look at little-miss Nikki – she’s the biggest drain of all. If the white insurance-salesman, local pols in the midlands and up-state don’t get their heads out of their asses and maybe if they’d take a drive outside their gated communities to at least a little further than Kohls and Panara’s maybe they’de understand how much they fail.

Reply
Uncle Remus November 26, 2012 at 1:37 pm

But have you noted all of the negroes living off the system. Having kid after kid on medicaid. 55% of all deliveries are Medicaid funded. The majority are negroes. Then, that is only the beginning. Then comes food stamps / WIC, and a govt check monthly. All of these guys carry smartphones, ect. WTF!

Reply
Stephan November 26, 2012 at 2:09 pm

Uncle Remus – raise ’em stupid, deny them education, make sure their towns have no jobs – and you get what you get.

Of course little brat white kids in Lexington all have iPhones – purchased by Dad thanks to his bloated state gubermint job.

Reply
? November 26, 2012 at 3:34 pm

“Of course little brat white kids in Lexington all have iPhones – purchased by Dad thanks to his bloated state gubermint job.”

True justice would be the well drying up for pops, but I’ve a feeling little whitebread Johnny is going to bear some of the brunt of all this dysfunction eventually and his Iphone skills aren’t gonna keep him meaningfully employed forever if govco can’t keep the shit from hitting the fan. (if it does though I’m sure pops will give his worthless son a job someplace in gov’t though, you see it everywhere)

Reply
not too smart November 26, 2012 at 8:08 pm

Uncle Remus – you have fallen for the myth… or should I say myff. There are just as many poor whites on medicaid in this state as there are blacks on medicaid. And look at the nationwide numbers. You really should channel your hate toward the mexicans. http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparebar.jsp?ind=158&cat=3

Reply
Smick February 15, 2013 at 12:56 am

Not trying to be racist at all, but there are a lot more white people than black people. That being said, the taker to maker % in the Black race is much higher than that of the white race.

Reply
Smick February 14, 2013 at 11:56 pm

Not trying to be racist at all, but there are a lot more white people than black people. That being said, the taker to maker % in the Black race is much higher than that of the white race.

Reply
Stephan November 26, 2012 at 1:29 pm

Just drove up 321 from Estil to Columbia last Friday. Death spiral? That’s too kind. My wife and mother-in-law – both from a third world South American country – said the poverty looked worse than in their home country. Most of the state has been left to rot – and rotten it has gotten. Stick a fork in SC – it’s done. What the great leaders of Sherman’s army couldn’t accomplish the state GOP leadership is doing very well.

Reply
scsince60 November 26, 2012 at 2:31 pm

If my wife was non-white I would probably admire Sherman too. Why on earth don’t you and your family leave?

Reply
scsince60 November 26, 2012 at 2:37 pm

“were” non-white.. Sorry my negrobonics was showing.

Reply
Stephan November 26, 2012 at 3:40 pm

scsince60 – got to 321 from GA – which we crossed after we left Florida – so I already did leave. I have kids that need good educations – which they get here with their other white friends (see – we’re all white – and that’s all right.) Still doesn’t keep your state (and my former state) from being a crap hole. Such as shame. You just stay and keep it that way. Then again, about half way through it I realized if I got pulled over the cops could ask my wife (an American citizen) and my mother-in-law (legal resident alien) for their papers.

Reply
coosaw November 26, 2012 at 2:27 pm

I’m certain this is in direct proportion to the ratio of blacks (mostly takers) to whites (mostly makers) in our state.

Reply
Nurse Mildred Ratched November 26, 2012 at 6:26 pm

You boys are starting to make intelligent, insightful comments. If you get too good, I’ll have to release you from the asylum. For now, all of you have a 24 hour, unescorted pass through the front gate. Just don’t hang out together!

Reply
Soft Sigh from Hell November 26, 2012 at 6:32 pm

“Forbes list of Best Countries for Business. I’ll list the top ten.”

“New Zealand
Denmark
Hong Kong
Singapore
Canada
Ireland
Sweden
Norway
Finland
United Kingdom”

My, my, a whole lot of what GOPers (Grover’s Own Party) would call “socialism” in there. How can that be? National health care ruins capitalism doesn’t it? And old age pensions.

Reply
Isotope Soap November 26, 2012 at 7:54 pm

Hahaha! Right on!

Reply
? November 27, 2012 at 7:23 am

Remind me, which one of these countries spend money on daily drone strikes?

I keeed….

Of course, the argument that socialized healthcare “ruins” capitalism isn’t as much the issue as the quality of care under a more capitalistic system.

But I digress, carry on.

Reply
Jan November 27, 2012 at 9:57 am

There you go again. In every one of the countries on this list, the life expectancy of the average resident is longer than in the US, the infant mortality rate is lower. There is no evidence that the quality of care for the average person is better in the US than in any of these countries. The evidence is to the contrary.

Furter in poll after poll Europeans are happier with their health care system Americans are with their health care system.

Amercans also pay more per capita for health care than any of these countries.

Reply
Jan November 27, 2012 at 9:59 am

Excuse me, In poll after poll Europeans are happier with their health care system than American’s are with their health care system.

Reply
Frank Pytel November 27, 2012 at 10:07 am

Americans are less happy with their health care system because the government subsidies for welfare recpients artificially inflate the cost of healthcare. If the government would stop paying for people to go to the ER for a damn cold then prices would be lower. Lower prices equal happier people. :) Ask Walmart. They get it.

Have a Great Day!! :) There won’t be many left with the Republicrats and Demlicans in charge.

Frank Pytel

conservative for obama at gmail dot com

Reply
? November 28, 2012 at 1:54 pm

“Excuse me, In poll after poll Europeans are happier with their health care system than American’s are with their health care system.”

There are many things that are currently dogging our health care system and I don’t think the incidence of the rise of large health insurance companies while the healthcare system in the US has been degrading, especially over the last 10 years is coincidental.

As for the polls you reference(I’m sure they exist, but I always appreciate a link), if I lived in a poor part of Africa my entire life and was suffering from a bacterial infection that could be cured with an antibiotic I wouldn’t give a damn if someone gave it to me with a dirty needle, now would I?

I’d surely take the chance on the dirty needle over NOTHING, and I’d make sure a poll taker knew I was happy with my healthcare outcome.

In the bigger picture Jan, all of those countries listed have great economic situations, which depending on how you look at it may be the REASON for quality healthcare.

I don’t know many people that would suggest quality healthcare comes first before a “good” economy, but none the less it is quite obvious that a “good” economy goes a long way to providing good healthcare. Even further, you must acknowledge that there was a time in which the US dominated and ranked at the top in healthcare(which happens to coincide with good economics).

So what has changed?

Reply
Breanna November 29, 2012 at 9:37 pm

the reason why these countries are doing well with business is because of their business tax rates.look at Ireland for example. we love to do business over there, hell even move over there because their tax rate is a whole lot less than ours which, by the way, is the highest in the world.

Reply
Booyah November 26, 2012 at 11:33 pm

“If you choose to live off the taxpayers teat, whether it’s getting paid to kill people or not you should be calling the shots on how the money is spent. ”

Bullshit. The military allows the rest of the country to sit on its arse and have all the lovely recreational wars it wants. Servicepeople and veterans are also the only Americans (with VERY few exceptions) with a clue about “war” and military policy. They are an asset to the electorate, and much less warlike than the flock of “chickenhawks” who so eagerly involve the US in war after war.

Vets aren’t a problem. Most have a sense of duty. The civilians are the hogs.

MilPork is so tasty civilian idiots like (Chickenhawk multi-deferment COWARD) Romney wanted to drop two trillion on DoD it didn’t even ask for.

Reply
? November 27, 2012 at 7:20 am

I don’t disagree with much of what you’ve said-but it doesn’t change the basic philosophy surrounding allowing those that are receivers from the “system” a vote as being the paramount of stupidity.

While you are right in America loving war(on both sides of the current political spectrum), it doesn’t change the inherent problems with allowing those on the teat a vote. I’m not in agreement with you in your view as the DoD and its members being “uninterested” in money coming their way no matter the route for the good of the country. Everyone has a degree of self interest.

That being said, if they are the paragons of virture you suggest, even if we throw the philosophy of not letting net takers a vote then let us look at the simple strategy of keeping fiscally solvent another way:

If you add up everyone associated with the MIC, let me assure you that despite the civilian contractors, armed forces, pentagon, NSA/CIA/FBI, etc. et al you still come no where NEAR the number of people voting that are leeching off the system(welfare recepients, etc) in terms of raw voting numbers/power.

So if the MIC member are truly interested in what is good for the country they should bite the bullet of non voting status if nothing else but to assure that a pool of net contributors are casting votes of sanity instead of irrational pure self interest.(for the sake of the country as a whole)

Bring back intent in the original Constitution of allowing only a property owners a vote(and do without the racist bullshit) and even further re-institute poll taxes or something along those lines.

Reply
dwb619 November 27, 2012 at 9:40 pm

wwwrawstory/rs/2012/11/27/grayson-walmart-is-the-largest-recipient-of-public-aid-in-the-country/

Reply
? November 28, 2012 at 2:05 pm

@ dwb619

Do I actually have to state that Walmart shouldn’t be getting welfare?

Does your link have any impact on what I’ve written above? Not that I can see.

Reply
Liz Crum Bum November 27, 2012 at 8:02 am

I have a solution to this mess. Miz Lilly should be our new guvna.

Reply
Old Bike Dude November 27, 2012 at 8:08 am

In Forbes’ list, federal employees were not counted as takers. Texas is #1 in federal wages and salaries. All southern red states lead the nation in EIC filings which is a huge drain on the budget. Shut down EIC payments and Walmart employees lose their annual bonus.

Reply
dwb619 November 27, 2012 at 6:49 pm

You hit the nail on the head!
I don’t do Wal-Mart.
Support your locally owned mom and pop businesses.
Don’t do Lowes or Home Depot either.BUY AMERICAN MADE, the job you save could be yours!

Reply
Breanna November 29, 2012 at 9:40 pm

i agree with getting rid of eic. all it does is give permission to women to have babies, as many as they can. in fact, if we get rid of this tax credit, we may even see a reduction in illegitimate births, medicaid and food stamp recipients. hhhmmm. lets do it!

Reply
Fitzpatrick November 27, 2012 at 11:05 am

Don’t give all credit to our governor of two years; much should go to our crusty legislature that actually controls taxing and spending. With Glenn McConnell’s recent departure, the CEOs would be Leatherman, Courson and Harrell.

Reply
The Fonz November 27, 2012 at 6:20 pm

Good thing I live in Charleston not SC……..

Reply

Leave a Comment