Dem Coming Out For Fair Tax

By waterdog on August 5th, 2008 at 7:10 pm

Lindsey better start doing Meet the people instead of Meet the Press. He believes that he is safe due to what polls are showing. However, this nobody is going to embarrass him by getting 40% if he doesn’t get off his high horse and start remembering his friends. Lindsey has forgotten who his friends are and certainly doesn’t call them anymore. He is shielded from real people and supporters by Edward, Scott, and Denise. He has been warned.

By Brian Frank on August 5th, 2008 at 8:16 pm

Support Bob Conley
send him a Dollar or two!
vote for him on Nov 5th!

By Lindsey Sux on August 5th, 2008 at 10:28 pm

American Spectator: The Worst Republican Senator (Lindsey Graham)
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=13219

Democrat Bob Conley offers conservatives a real choice in November
http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A47105

By jed on August 5th, 2008 at 11:50 pm

P&C article today says he has less than $1k on hand… DINO vs. RINO… won’t even be close. But it should be interesting with Dems and GOPers both crossing over in this race.

By Philip Branton on August 6th, 2008 at 3:53 am

Flat TOP BOB……………..

A play right out of the ALI …..handbook !!!

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/S/SC_SENATE_CONLEY_SCOL-?SITE=SCCHA&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Bob…… This show of MOXY is GREAT !!

This shows that you care about the views of ALL South Carolinians !!

ALL !!! ( Fist POUNDS !! )

At least you cared enough to be THERE … WHERE WAS Senatoro Lindse’ Suave’ Graham-nista !!

Keep showing up at all functions…… Dems and Repubs !!!! If the press ignores YOU …take a picture and put it on your WEBSITE !! If the officials won’t LET YOU in….take a picture and ….WHAT !!

BOB….this is the DOG DAYS of …AUGUST !! KEEP GROWLING !!!

By PalmettoCPA on August 6th, 2008 at 7:53 am

The FairTax does not lower the overall tax burden. Since it is supposed to be revenue neutral, the total amount of taxes the federal government extracts from the citizens of the United States would be the same as it is now. Is it worth expending so much effort on changing the way the federal government collects taxes instead of changing the amount that the federal government collects in taxes?

http://mises.org/story/2961

How about addressing the spending-side first?

By FWFIV on August 6th, 2008 at 8:36 am

#12
As I understand it the Fair Tax is more akin to a national sales tax to be paid at point of purchase for goods and services in this country. If you look into the issue you can see they have played some games with what percentage that would really have to be. That is not “more like a flat tax”. Also the organization needed to send the “prebate” check out to every American every month would need to be even larger than the IRS is now. Not to mention the type of society we would be advocating if everyone expected a government check on a monthly basis.Although there are some good theories in parts of the Fair Tax, it is basically being advocated and funded by the wealthiest segment of our society. There is a reaon for that.

By Katherine Jenerette on August 6th, 2008 at 9:22 am

From its founding, our country operated without a personal income tax for 137 years.

My bottom line on income tax may sound simplistic, but I believe that a tax on a person’s income violates the basic principals of our original Constitution and the Declaration of Independence with regard to the equality of all men.

The basic principal of a free man is that he cannot be owned by another man or no man can own another man’s labor. To say that the government can violate this principal is a contradiction of our uniquely American beliefs of freedom.

Once the government can sweep aside the boundary between its hand and your wallet; which is your labor, they have violated the principal of a free man.

Secondly is the principal of a limited government is violated by creating institutions that both increase the size of the federal government; which in turn, allows those institutions to control and limit the opportunities of a free people.

While I support the concept of a fair tax, I believe it is an idea with its’ “heart in the right place; especially with the overriding objective of the repeal of the 16th Amendment but I believe it is a work in progress.

When I finish with my Army duties and if I have the opportunity to shape a legislative agenda one of my priorities is that there should be no income tax and the 16th Amendment should be repealed.

First, I would move to repeal the 16th Amendment. Concurrently; upon ratification of the appeal, institute a National Sales Tax of 23% which will be reduced each congress by 3%. Thereby, by law, this tax will be reduced 3% every two years, which will force the government to shrink 3% every two years. Within 18 years, there will be no national Sales Tax and the government will have to have shrunk by approx 23%.

I do not agree with the concepts of pre-bates. It is another federal government control mechanism that allows the federal government to maintain leverage over an individual which would be a close cousin to the system we have right now. This would build another level of dependency on the federal government, which would extend far beyond those persons dependent on the federal government right now. However, some legislative plan will have to be enacted for those persons below a certain income level that will be most impacted by the initial 23% tax and indexed until the moratorium is reached.

No matter how the legislation is worded or worked out the message to the Federal Government is this:

Get away from our income. The only exception that I can conceive of myself, would be during a war declared by Congress in accordance with the Constitution of the United States, Article 1, Section 8.

Katherine
http://www.jenerette.com/kmj_bio/

By TheNightFly on August 6th, 2008 at 9:59 am

FWFIV, the Fair tax is a progressive national retail sales tax while the Flat tax is a regressive income tax. The Flat tax is inherently regressive precisely because it’s flat. People living significantly above the poverty level could afford to pay it but people living at or below the poverty level can’t. The Fair tax is progressive because it refunds 100% of the sales tax paid on spending at the poverty level. The poverty level is the same for all persons so the rebate will be the same for all persons.

The issue people are having about the tax rate is not gameplay, nobody’s trying to trick us. People are just getting confused over unfamiliar tax lingo. It’s actually pretty simple. Say you spend $10 on lunch and the sales tax is 10%. A regular sales tax would be calculated as 10% of $10 ($1) added back to $10 resulting in a total of $11, right? That’s called an “exclusive” tax rate. Under the Fair tax, the $1 tax would be included in the total price so you want to use the “inclusive” tax rate instead. $1 is 9% of $11. Whether you use 10% “exclusive” or 9% “inclusive”, the cost of lunch is the same after all. :)

By Palmetto CPA on August 6th, 2008 at 10:22 am

“Gouging”…I knew that one was coming. Nice try.

The only tax return I prepare every year is my own. Well, and my parents, but they don’t pay me anything. Believe it or not, there are lots of CPA’s such as myself who have nothing to do with tax. I hate the current tax code, but also realize that the “FairTax” is not a legitimate solution.

It’s simpleminded emotional folks like Gouging who fail to address the fundamental failings of their proposed system, and instead rely on their hatred of the current system. I suggest you read the link posted in #11.

“The FairTax does not eliminate the IRS. Calling the IRS by another name, and redirecting its mission, is hardly eliminating it. Just as the income tax would be replaced by the FairTax, so the IRS would be replaced by the “Sales Tax Bureau” in the Treasury Department. True, there would be no more audits, no more tax forms, no more April 15, and no more compliance costs for individuals, but there would be an increase in these things for businesses.”

“Even if the prices of goods and services fall after the change to the FairTax system, with the sale of new homes and cars being taxed, as well as services from heart surgeries down to haircuts, the FairTax would result in a tremendous change in American society. Is it worth expending so much effort on changing the way the federal government collects taxes instead of changing the amount that the federal government collects in taxes?”

Bottom line: Cut spending, Cut taxes.

By Tim on August 6th, 2008 at 11:45 am

FairTax is an interesting stink bomb to throw at the IRS. But this story really missed the Dem scoop. Conley is totally and utterly with Sanford on things like Rexasaurus, Leatherhead, and Egg-Tooth. The Dem Party poured the love on Inez because she was the kind of economic Lib that Fritz wasn’t. Not only is Flat Top way to the economic Right of Fritz, he’s thinks Sanford could have tried even harder to make the RINOs in the legislature hate him. Other than RINO employees, who has ever really been scared of a DINO? I’d never even heard of one until this article. Harry Flood Byrd was the most hardright conservative governor (Virginia) on economics since WWII. He was a Democrat.

By Andy Groucho on August 6th, 2008 at 1:02 pm

Hey Katherine… You not only lost to a man who hardly campaigned, but you got your ass handed to you on a silver platter. Therefore, it is apparent that nobody cares to read your posts that rival the Old Testament in length.

And as far as Bob Conley is concerned, this is why the SCDP needs to screen candidates before allowing people like Conley, Cheryl Footman, Emile DeFelice and Glenn Lindmann to run for office. I mean Hell, if Colbert wasn’t allowed to run for President in South Carolina, why in the world is “Flat Top Bob’ being allowed to run for the most deliberative body on the globe?

By Katherine Jenerette on August 6th, 2008 at 3:51 pm

To Andy Grouch0 #23 and To ‘Dirty WaterDog” #22 (Van Halen – good song!)

“…no candidate would i support…his platform could i endorse
another accomplice slinging dirt…i’m just a sucker for a pretty face…”

Thanks for the feedback. I’m not sure how your comments about me contributes to the ‘tax-big-federal-government’ debate but you help clear up a few things for me out side of politics:

#1) Along with many others, we have taken our behinds off of ’silver platters’ and put them on the real-world firing line to protect your right to free speech and I really do believe in this US Constitution stuff.

#2) You both probably never saw the inside of a US Military Uniform; but don’t worry, I’ve got your back covered along with some very fine young soldiers who also believe in our country and our system of individual rights and self government by the people.

#3) Last, but not least – Taxes suck.

Okay guys. Take your next shot. Feel your power.

Katherine
http://www.jenerette.com/photos3/content/jenerette_jump7_apr08v555_large.html

P.S. I spent less than $2000(after filing fees) on a campaign that had a net result of 2d place, with over 11,000 votes in a three-man race wedged in between my Army duty – and less than 75-days to pull it together with some great volunteers. I’m not going away anytime soon guys, and I don’t need your permission to run for political office in this country or this state. I intend to be the last man standing; or go down fighting – KMJ

By Tom on August 6th, 2008 at 7:31 pm

The Fair Tax is a good first step but the end goal should be getting rid of personal income taxes completely.

The two major parties we currently have are just polishing brass on the Titanic!

A real man will reach out to individuals regardless of party lines on taxes, illegal aliens, undeclared wars in violation of the U.S. Constitution, and corporate welfare.

Bob’s got my vote and my donation!

Go to http://aimhighwithbob.com if you want to make a REAL difference this November 4th!

By John Paul McDaniel on August 7th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

We here in Texas have a state sales tax and it has resulted in NONE! of the dire predictions some have foreseen. There has been no scandal, corruption, or cheating in relation to it. It has funded our state government SPLENDIDLY! We Texans, tourists, illegal aliens, criminals, etc. are all in INSTANT COMPLIANCE!! every time we go through the “cash-register-check-out-line”. Virtually no one escapes paying. If it works for Texas it will work for the nation. THINK ABOUT IT MORE…………………………………………… Read and Enjoy………………………………………….. APRIL 15TH????? Let’s make it just another Spring day.

HR 25, the Fair Tax Act, is in the House Ways and Means Committee of
congress, waiting to be passed into law. If passed, the Income Tax &
IRS would be abolished and replaced with a national (retail only) sales
tax.

Everyone shoud go to: http://www.congress.org and tell their congressmen that
they want HR 25 passed into law ASAP!!!! If we all “push together”, we
can make it happen. There’s nothing to it, BUT TO DO IT!!!!!!

Read and Enjoy.

The FINAL SOLUTION!! for the IRS & Income Tax Problem

50 Reasons I Support the FairTax
(How many reasons can you give for supporting the present obsolete IRS
& income tax system?)

Those Who Know the Facts Love the Fair Tax
“Family Friendly Tax Reform”
Tax Reform with far less pain and much more gain!
Out with the Old Code and in with the New (national RETAIL ONLY sales
tax).

http://www.fairtax.org

1. It allows you to keep 100% of your paycheck, with nothing withheld
for Social Security and Medicare payments.
2. It eliminates the regressive payroll tax that hurts the poor.
Currently, every one of us is taxed a minimum of 7.65% on our first-dollar of
wages up to $90,000, if we earn that much.
3. It assures that the wealthiest Americans will be voluntarily helping
to fund social security with every last dollar they spend above the
poverty level. Today, earnings are subject to payroll taxes only up to
$90,000. The wealthiest Americans therefore do not pay into the system
above that amount. If their earnings are from investments, no earnings
fund the Social Security system. Under the FairTax, a single purchase
(regardless of the source of the earnings) can result in greater
contributions to the Social Security system than would be paid by an individual
under the payroll tax of today.
4. It provides funding for Social Security and Medicare at a level
equal to or greater than at present, with a stronger and broader tax base.
5. It secures the future of Social Security and Medicare because all
spenders fund it and not just the workers.
6. It eliminates all personal income taxes, payroll taxes, corporate
income taxes, gift taxes, death taxes, and capital gains taxes.
7. It eliminates the income tax and the IRS. Members of Congress and
the public overwhelmingly agree that the current internal revenue code is
cumbersome, intrusive, coercive, and inefficient.
8. It is revenue neutral with the present income tax system, funding
the federal budget at current levels.
9. It will remove an average of 22% of the cost of American made goods
by removing the built-in payroll tax (the other 7.65% of earnings that
employers pay) and other business taxes that are now passed to
consumers as an “embedded” tax of approximately 22% due to the cascading of
income and payroll taxes paid by U.S. employers, at every step of
production, to the U.S. Treasury.
10. It doesn’t tax used items ? clothes, cars, homes. Only new items
are taxed when sold by a business to an individual.
11. It is progressive, a “prebate” of the tax amount up to the poverty
level is given to everyone. This means that those spending below the
poverty level have a net gain because the “prebate” exceeds the amount
paid in taxes. (Under the present system they pay the payroll tax even if
they get a full refund of income tax withheld.)

12. It eliminates 90% of the cost of compliance. American families and
American businesses waste an estimated $250 ? $600 billion per year
doing the paperwork necessary to comply with the tax code. That is roughly
$1,000 ? $2,000 annually for every man, woman and child in the U.S.
13. It creates an opportunity for our products to leave this country
costing an average of 25% less, thus increasing our exports, lower our
deficit balance of trade, and increasing employment at home.
14. It encourages investment in companies located in the U.S., thus
providing a home for money already in the US and attracting more. The U.S.
will be the most attractive tax-free haven in the world for doing
business. American companies will return from offshore and overseas.
15. It encourages repatriation to the U.S. of money held by U.S.
individuals and companies now in foreign countries, with no tax consequence.
16. All 290 million Americans and 51 million visiting tourists fund
Social Security and Medicare with their purchases. Today only 110 million
workers fund these programs via deductions from their paychecks.
17. The broader tax base includes the ten percent of our economy, an
estimated $1 trillion, that today is underground or under the table.
Under the FairTax, the illegal drug dealer will pay his tax just like the
rest of us when he buys his sunglasses, BMW, and other items, as will
those who do business for cash.
18. It allows families to save more for home ownership, education, and
retirement. An average family making $50,000 will have $7,500 more
spendable income.
19. It makes educational tuition a tax-free expenditure of tax-free
income.
20. It makes American products more competitive overseas by removing
the embedded tax from them, thus lowering their prices, which compensates
for low foreign wages.
21. It makes American products more competitive at home by removing the
embedded tax from them, compensating for the low cost of imported
products not burdened by taxes imposed by exporting countries.
22. It removes the need for formal 401-K’s, IRAs, HSA, etc. Anyone will
be able to set up any kind of savings or investment account without
regard to taxes or the government.
23. It frees churches and other non-profit organizations from the
expense of filing tax returns and paying their half of Social Security and
Medicare payments for employees. There will no longer be any 501.c.3 or
501.c.4 non-profit tax status, because there will be no more tax to be
exempt from.
24. It restores to churches and non-profit organizations the 1st
Amendment right to engage in free speech, without fear of losing their
tax-free status.
25. It gives individuals and businesses the right to donate as much as
they want to in a given year to charitable causes.
26. It restores the 4th Amendment, protecting against unreasonable
searches and seizures, from which the IRS presently is exempt.
27. It restores the 5th Amendment, which guarantees the right to due
process. Under current systems the IRS has their own courts with their
own set of rules not included in the 5th.
28. It cleans up a major flaw in campaign financing, eliminating
campaign donations for “tax favors”.
29. It eliminates wrangling in Congress over tax cuts, the tax code,
and who is or is not paying a fair share of the tax bill.
30. It encourages work by letting workers keep 100% of their earnings
and giving a rebate, to boot, making the notion that the more you work,
the more money you have, a reality, unlike the current system where
welfare is lost when you go to work, so your first dollars earned after
taxes just offset what you were currently getting in welfare, making you
no better off.
31. It allows more of the lower income families to become home owners
by allowing a second job income above their current income (all tax
free) to be applied to a mortgage. Money for down payments for homes is
also saved totally tax free so that it will accumulate faster.
32. It allows families to retain farms and businesses in the hands of
those who built them through the elimination of the death tax.
33. It allows families to help each other out tax-free, by eliminating
the gift tax.
34. It encourages individuals to self-insure, making the health system
more direct pay (no 3rd party pay), thus bringing costs down.
35. Without FICA to pay, most states, counties, municipalities, and
school districts will see a large increase in their state budget revenues,
additionally lowering the overall tax burden (State & Federal) for most
Americans.
36. It assures that no American will find, at the end of the year, a
need to get a loan to pay taxes as an alternative to penalties, interest,
or cheating.
37. It restores individual privacy. The government no longer needs to
know where you work, what you are earning, and what you are doing with
it.
38. It eliminates the need to have a “marriage” clarification declaring
who you live with, as that has no bearing at all on a state or federal
sales tax.
39. It eliminates the need for courts to decide which divorced parent
gets to take the tax deduction for children.
40. It reduces production costs for farmers and other subsidized
businesses, leading to a reduction in subsidies, thus reducing the federal
budget.
41. It eliminates the administrative costs incurred by states in
collection of state sales taxes because states will piggyback the state tax
collection onto the national tax collection, for which they are
compensated by the FairTax ?% administrative cost give-back. [Doesn't this go
to the retailers?]
42. It results in a windfall profit for many of those holding taxable
corporate high interest bonds at the time of passage of FairTax, since
they will not be taxed under FairTax. (A higher interest rate is usually
paid to entice investors to buy the corporate bonds rather than go with
the lower interest, but tax free, municipal bonds, now.)
43. It shifts the tax to consumption, which consumption tables over
time show is more stable than income, therefore the tax revenue stream is
likely to be a more stable and predictable amount.
44. It results in Federal Reserve rates being based on current
consumption, which is rather stable, instead of future earnings, which are less
predictable, resulting in surer inflation prevention.
45. It allows for better planning by businesses, because they no longer
have to consider tax implications for everything they do.
46. It makes higher employment or better compensation possible in the
small business sector where today it costs approximately three dollars
in compliance costs to pay one dollar in payroll and income taxes.
47. It moves many now providing tax preparation, advice, accounting,
planning, and records maintenance into an expansive economy where they
will be producing goods and services. There they can add to the standard
of living of all Americans and likely earn more than they do currently,
instead of shuffling paper for the government (and not contributing
anything economically to society).
48. It relieves citizens of the risk of facing the shift in burden of
proof that is so common with the current system, i.e., the taxpayer is
guilty unless innocence can be proved, when even IRS staff sometimes
give conflicting interpretations.
49. It’s simple, unambiguous, and certain, the opposite of the current
tax code.
50. It’s good for the environment. It reportedly would save about
300,000 trees a year that are needed to produce the paper for the IRS
compliance and tax forms, enough to reach around the equator placed end to
end 28 times. Also, since it taxes only new items, it would encourage
buying tax-free pre-owned cars, clothes, furniture, houses, etc. Reuse is
good for the environment, too.

Best Regards,
John Paul McDaniel

Go to: http://www.fairtax.org PLEASE CONSIDER THIS ALSO: 22% of all that you buy currently is tax / tax compliance cost. When that cost goes away (under the Fair Tax) the price of your $1.00 item (purchased at Wal-Mart, for example) drops in price to 78 cents (without damaging the profit margin). 1.23 X 78 cents = 96 cents. Seeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!! Even with the 23% Fair Tax added on, your originally $1.00 item is now 4 cents cheaper. The “out-of-pocket” cost of living , under the Fair Tax , will be no more than it is now. Under the Fair Tax there are NO LOSERS, only winners, the difference being that some win BIGGER!!!! than others due th their increased FRUGALITY.

Best Regards,
John Paul McDaniel

By Atalaya princess on August 16th, 2008 at 9:56 am

When is Van Jenerette’s trial date anyway? Is he still on the payroll or, God forbid, teaching?
I’m mean, Katherine loves to yammer away on the blogosphere. Maybe she could actually say something interesting for once.